Stayers & Quitters
- Thread starter claire_p86
- Start date
shinobi
New member
that's not true. depending on how you play your cards, it could bring you to court 8)
i don't understand how change can be criminalised by the PAP, even when it is for the good of the people. i am not partisan to any political party, i only care about the society.
I feel that we are treated like second class citizens in our own country.
Foreign Talents get treated like kings after being wooed here.
Foreign students come here on scholarships and can get government subsidies for their education. In university ,they have to serve a 2 year bond with the government, but surely that isn't as tough as our NS.
We go to foreign universities overseas, we do not receive any subsidies.
When working still got reservist, foreign talent stay in office.
Got war foreign talent pack bags and leave. We have to stay here and fight....
Foreign Talents get treated like kings after being wooed here.
Foreign students come here on scholarships and can get government subsidies for their education. In university ,they have to serve a 2 year bond with the government, but surely that isn't as tough as our NS.
We go to foreign universities overseas, we do not receive any subsidies.
When working still got reservist, foreign talent stay in office.
Got war foreign talent pack bags and leave. We have to stay here and fight....
C'mon. Look at Dr. Chee and Gapolan Nair. Where are they now?
Look at what the government is doing to them. And to think about it, remember the ISA? The ISA was an act that came to power during the pre-independence Emergency period. The British employed it so that they would ultimately have total control of the country.
The ISA was originally meant to detain Communists without any warrants or questions.
And we have to remember during our post-independence era, our MM did not scrap the ISA and instead used it to detain his political rivals as he liked.
Ah, why is it so hard to be an opposition in Singapore?
But back to the topic, Singapore's politics puts me off and it's the BIGGEST factor that made me decide to go elsewhere.
Donaldsps
New member
Same here.So have your voted before?I am only 18,so not yet voted...Wonder how its like beacuse my Bishan Area dosen't have opposition so no need to ballot durin election.
dir
New member
google quote says
"The test of courage comes when we are in the minority. The test of tolerance comes when we are in the majority."
I don't think the efforts of opposition politicians are in vain just yet! Being a politician is a selfless act in and of itself, so I totally understand if anyone wants to GTFO as far away as possible from here while they still can.
"The test of courage comes when we are in the minority. The test of tolerance comes when we are in the majority."
I don't think the efforts of opposition politicians are in vain just yet! Being a politician is a selfless act in and of itself, so I totally understand if anyone wants to GTFO as far away as possible from here while they still can.
henryvelge
New member
i heard that the un sees us a communist country.
is that true?
is that true?
Anirudh
New member
No lah obviously not -.-
but i wouldnt be surprised if Singapore is viewed as one of the most tightly controlled democracies in the world. No demonstrations, no way to voice our displeasure over political matters etc etc.
well what can i say, back in the our MM's rivals all went to jail (hmmm, i wonder why)...now his son is the PM out of so many other eligible candidates..his other son was CEO of the biggest telecommunications company and his daughter in-law boss of Starhub. Nothing fishy here?
For a more detailed read, i direct you here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Totalitarian_democracy
but i wouldnt be surprised if Singapore is viewed as one of the most tightly controlled democracies in the world. No demonstrations, no way to voice our displeasure over political matters etc etc.
well what can i say, back in the our MM's rivals all went to jail (hmmm, i wonder why)...now his son is the PM out of so many other eligible candidates..his other son was CEO of the biggest telecommunications company and his daughter in-law boss of Starhub. Nothing fishy here?
For a more detailed read, i direct you here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Totalitarian_democracy
theblueark
New member
I am of the opinion that democracies have vital flaws and do not work well. I agree we do have somewhat of a totalitarian democracy, but not in a bad way. They have been smart about it and sought to weed out all corruption.
I often wonder, when people wish for change over here, what is it that they wish for? I see vital flaws in most of the changes proposed.
E.g:
Allow free speech, strikes, demonstrations and protests. In Singapore? Massive loss of efficiency. Thousands, even millions of dollars of profits thrown away.
Provide welfare to the poor. Someone has to decide "who" are the poor. A line has to be drawn, and everyone just above that line, who are just straddling above "poor" will decide, hey, what for I work. I might as well be "poor" and get welfare. Loss of efficiency again.
Don't bring in so many foreigners, give Singaporeans more. It's not a case of intentionally bringing in foreigners, so much as bringing in skills in sectors lacking in Singapore, at a cost efficient price.
Maybe it helps that I don't think of Singapore so much as my motherland, as a super efficient, gigantic, global company. Our PM is the CEO, with his finance departments, planning departments and such. And his job is to run Singapore in such a way that Singapore gets as rich as possible. When you think of it this way, you realise a lot of our policies make a lot of sense.
That said though, even with the benefits, not everybody likes working in a stressful, demanding, multi-national corporation.
I often wonder, when people wish for change over here, what is it that they wish for? I see vital flaws in most of the changes proposed.
E.g:
Allow free speech, strikes, demonstrations and protests. In Singapore? Massive loss of efficiency. Thousands, even millions of dollars of profits thrown away.
Provide welfare to the poor. Someone has to decide "who" are the poor. A line has to be drawn, and everyone just above that line, who are just straddling above "poor" will decide, hey, what for I work. I might as well be "poor" and get welfare. Loss of efficiency again.
Don't bring in so many foreigners, give Singaporeans more. It's not a case of intentionally bringing in foreigners, so much as bringing in skills in sectors lacking in Singapore, at a cost efficient price.
Maybe it helps that I don't think of Singapore so much as my motherland, as a super efficient, gigantic, global company. Our PM is the CEO, with his finance departments, planning departments and such. And his job is to run Singapore in such a way that Singapore gets as rich as possible. When you think of it this way, you realise a lot of our policies make a lot of sense.
That said though, even with the benefits, not everybody likes working in a stressful, demanding, multi-national corporation.
subversion
Moderator
it's not difficult, really. be credible, that's about it. don't go round hawker centres shouting for democracy & people will support you.
Sylvia Lim (WP) is a good reference.
bro Blueark, I tot MNCs gotch a lot of backstabbing, b_tching, politicking and favouritism - how to be efficient lidat?
RoRK dericates song for you ah
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OMLoAtC9RY
RoRK dericates song for you ah
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OMLoAtC9RY
theblueark
New member
No matter what the means, the fact is, MNCs are a lot bigger and a lot richer than your average mom and pop neighborhood friendly store.
I think in any big organization there is backstabbing, b_tching, politicking and favoritism. It's human nature. Only when the organization is small and relaxed to people grow feelings for each other and protect the community. Then they get trampled on by the giants with their hardcore ways.
So the choice is either to learn from them and grow big and powerful, or stick to what your principles and beliefs, and whine.
I think in any big organization there is backstabbing, b_tching, politicking and favoritism. It's human nature. Only when the organization is small and relaxed to people grow feelings for each other and protect the community. Then they get trampled on by the giants with their hardcore ways.
So the choice is either to learn from them and grow big and powerful, or stick to what your principles and beliefs, and whine.
Heard of cooperatives?
Aiyah, bro, no perfection exist lah. It's all about making do, with your best with what you have. And then to make things better.
But when one makes excursions into comparison exercises, one should be looking at proper examples and to look into them fully. Otherwise, it's an exercise into rhetorical hoo-hahs.
To the best of my recollection, the most corrupted person in Singapore's post-independence history, based on the dollars and sense involved, is none other than a former MP. And you actually have a choice between Teh Cheang Wan and Phey Yew Kok. And perhaps the question stays only because with the closed-up media that we have, we really don't know the true extent of their corruption.
Aiyah, bro, no perfection exist lah. It's all about making do, with your best with what you have. And then to make things better.
But when one makes excursions into comparison exercises, one should be looking at proper examples and to look into them fully. Otherwise, it's an exercise into rhetorical hoo-hahs.
To the best of my recollection, the most corrupted person in Singapore's post-independence history, based on the dollars and sense involved, is none other than a former MP. And you actually have a choice between Teh Cheang Wan and Phey Yew Kok. And perhaps the question stays only because with the closed-up media that we have, we really don't know the true extent of their corruption.
fuzztremecho
New member
bro Rork
the latter was never found ? correct me if im wrong but i think he did a "Michal Vana?"..
the latter was never found ? correct me if im wrong but i think he did a "Michal Vana?"..
subversion
Moderator
in politics, we can never know the true extent of anything...
bro Fuzz...
Phey Yew Kok is the Missing Link! :mrgreen: Anthropology professors need him! haha!
The bugger disappeared into sexay thin air; curtained by lots of hot bubbly smoke, created by man-made fires.
bro sub, that's true that we can't know everything. The issue is whether there was a distinct and sincere thought-out process to look into the cases.
A more competitive and hence robust media environement could have led to more truths than what we have.
Phey Yew Kok is the Missing Link! :mrgreen: Anthropology professors need him! haha!
The bugger disappeared into sexay thin air; curtained by lots of hot bubbly smoke, created by man-made fires.
bro sub, that's true that we can't know everything. The issue is whether there was a distinct and sincere thought-out process to look into the cases.
A more competitive and hence robust media environement could have led to more truths than what we have.
THOA
New member
Despite that there are good opposition members, at the end of the day, the opposition isn't still represented sufficiently in the parliament.
And the best thing is, we don't even really know what's going on behind the scenes. Oh, besides Phey Yew Kok, did anyone remember what happened to Devan Nair?
I seriously find that Singapore lack transparency.
And geez, read this.
"There is nothing to prevent you from pushing your propaganda, to push your programme out either to the students or with the public at large... and if you can carry the ground, if you are right, you win. That's democracy. We're not preventing anybody" - Lee Kuan Yew, 31 January 2005
I hope he doesn't have to eat his words one day.
And the best thing is, we don't even really know what's going on behind the scenes. Oh, besides Phey Yew Kok, did anyone remember what happened to Devan Nair?
I seriously find that Singapore lack transparency.
And geez, read this.
"There is nothing to prevent you from pushing your propaganda, to push your programme out either to the students or with the public at large... and if you can carry the ground, if you are right, you win. That's democracy. We're not preventing anybody" - Lee Kuan Yew, 31 January 2005
I hope he doesn't have to eat his words one day.
hecklerkoch
New member
Politics (and whatever else you have little control over) aside, I am curious - how many of us actually crave for something new?
It can be anything. Environment, people, language, perspective, music, sights, smell, sounds etc.
If migrating permanently is not an option - would you consider relocating, say for about 5 years, just to experience something new?
I would jump at the opportunity, if you ask me.
I've always admired bro Tetragrammaton, for his experiences around the globe for years, doing so many types of work, studying and living in different countries. I think it takes a lot of courage and an actual thirst for life, to do what he has done.
I really think it helps one to open his or her mind more, after seeing the world from different perspectives and angles. Maybe many of us still rely on the information fed from the various media - television, movies, internet etc, and form our worlds around sometimes warped and packaged views. So, unless we see, hear, smell, touch and taste the world ourselves, ignorance and narrow-mindedness will always be a disease inflicting some of us 'stayers'.
IMHO.
It can be anything. Environment, people, language, perspective, music, sights, smell, sounds etc.
If migrating permanently is not an option - would you consider relocating, say for about 5 years, just to experience something new?
I would jump at the opportunity, if you ask me.
I've always admired bro Tetragrammaton, for his experiences around the globe for years, doing so many types of work, studying and living in different countries. I think it takes a lot of courage and an actual thirst for life, to do what he has done.
I really think it helps one to open his or her mind more, after seeing the world from different perspectives and angles. Maybe many of us still rely on the information fed from the various media - television, movies, internet etc, and form our worlds around sometimes warped and packaged views. So, unless we see, hear, smell, touch and taste the world ourselves, ignorance and narrow-mindedness will always be a disease inflicting some of us 'stayers'.
IMHO.
