PUNK

i thought this started out like a joke, and it became so serious?

There is no correct definition of the word "punk " at least for the Singaporean context. Its just made up of many people's unplesant oppinions.

i dont see a point in getting so serious, debating over such trivial stuff.
oh. maybe thats another trait of a punk eh, attacking other people's oppinion, claiming that theirs is more superior than the rest?? (no personal attack to anyone)
 
hifi_killer said:
maybe thats another trait of a punk eh, attacking other people's oppinion, claiming that theirs is more superior than the rest?? (no personal attack to anyone)

wah you say until like that, i think everyone is a punk here liao man! :lol:

just jk

Anyway, no point debating lah. Endless cycle.
Punk no punk, just enjoy good music man.
That's what soft.com is for tio bo. :lol:

If not talking about punk, talk about goths, ah bengs, ah lians, hair metal bands, old skool bands, it will always be an endless discussion.

So i think let's talk more about how to shred the next malmsteen solo instead.

LOL :lol:
 
nobody's saying people can't dress like punks (though there's no real social reason to have punks around in singapore, it would appear), it's just that nobody likes someone who dresses like a punk, thinks like an ignoramus, and behaves like an ass. :)

it's like religion. if you know about your religion, much respect. but if you're a blind follower, you're essentially an idiot.

i think punks should at least recognize political punk fashion as being related to a movement, and understand that movement, rather than committing it all to just "doing what they want". again, i think it's an excuse for ignorance. i think it's a little ignorant to ignore a heritage whose cultural sensibilities you actively participate in.

although clearly, Bottom_End, you sound far from ignorant. it's refreshing. :)
 
Vaiyen said:
in other words, don't be a poseur.

How you relate a poseur? By his actions? His beliefs? His dressing?

In actual paraphrasing, a minimum quality or trait to fulfil being labelled a "poseur" would require 2 contradicting factors before it's taken into effect.

Hence, when you describe "punks" as poseur, the choices would obviously have to be taken into account, before any outcome was determined and settled conclusively by you.

Which i can safely assume and conclude that, the 2 factors would be,
a) Bodily garments or adornments
b) Behavioral Antics

In this case, ah bengs or ah lians immediately disqualify themselves from the above argument, as the flaws are obvious. They do not dress up as punks, furthermore, their ludicrous acts alone does not justify.

And a direct quote from Brake, punks are defined as
"Lurex, old school uniforms, plastic garbage bags, safety pins, bondage and sexual fetishism were developed into a self-mocking, shocking image. Hair was shaved close to the head, dyed out- rageous colours, then later spiked up into cockatoo plumes of startling design".

First came the image, then came the movement.
Simple fact, people identify punks by their clothings.

Which in this case, your rebuttal holds no water and has a strong absence of credibility.

By the above presentation of evidence and summarized testimony, I see 2 contradicting factors existing within you.

a) You identified them as punks by their apparel
b) You feel that they're posuers, who dress up as punks, yet does not behave like one.

Hence, can i safely assume that you're a poseur as well?[/quote]


Once again, you are waaaay off the mark.

My comment was directed towards those who profess to be punk, but yet do not bother to find out the meaning and significance of the culture.

I can't be bothered by those who dress like punks.

Your confused rambling, disguised as intellectual discourse, crumbles under its own ponderous weight. A load of hot air, really.[/i]
 
Re: hey ho let`s go!!!!!

Dirt said:
kwang kwang kwang!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
answer lah Mr. intellectually inspired by your own eg.....


I would answer, if I could understand what you try to pass off as English.
 
Vaiyen said:
Once again, you are waaaay off the mark.

My comment was directed towards those who profess to be punk, but yet do not bother to find out the meaning and significance of the culture.

I can't be bothered by those who dress like punks.

Your confused rambling, disguised as intellectual discourse, crumbles under its own ponderous weight. A load of hot air, really.[/i]

err ok..whatever Singapore's Brainiest Kid. :lol:
 
Re: hey ho let`s go!!!!!

Vaiyen said:
Dirt said:
kwang kwang kwang!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
answer lah Mr. intellectually inspired by your own eg.....


I would answer, if I could understand what you try to pass off as English.

Let's end this thread lah.
It's too primitive for your highly developed brain..

Happy new year everybody! :lol:

edit: Happen to chance upon your blog.

http://ponderouspontifications.blogspot.com/

well written, but i pity your life.
 
hey ho...let`s go!!!!!!

it`s just a simple typo.....
supposed to b ego....y ?r u too smart to understand that or wat?! :lol: :lol:
 
Re: hey ho let`s go!!!!!

Bottom_End said:
Vaiyen said:
Dirt said:
kwang kwang kwang!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
answer lah Mr. intellectually inspired by your own eg.....


I would answer, if I could understand what you try to pass off as English.

Let's end this thread lah.
It's too primitive for your highly developed brain..

Happy new year everybody! :lol:

edit: Happen to chance upon your blog.

http://ponderouspontifications.blogspot.com/

well written, but i pity your life.



Nice roundabout way of retreating after you have been out-debated.
Feeble insult at the end of it too :lol:
 
Re: hey ho...let`s go!!!!!!

Dirt said:
it`s just a simple typo.....
supposed to b ego....y ?r u too smart to understand that or wat?! :lol: :lol:


Even so, it doesn't make sense grammatically at all.
But whatever man, I am not here to correct people's English.
 
hey ho...let`s go!!!!!!

*yawns......... :roll: :roll:
lame....................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................
*yawns again................

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
Re: hey ho...let`s go!!!!!!

Dirt said:
*yawns......... :roll: :roll:
lame....................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................
*yawns again................

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


hee...you are cute.
 
hey ho...let`s go!!!!!!

thanx!!!!!!!
that`s y they called me fat cat...... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
yea all i noe was mike ness had a rough time u noe.dats true punk go read about his life story hes the guitarist in social distortion
 
anep said:
(meaning dat what u THOUGHT was punk music actually IS NOT punk/real punk music)

yea problem with today stuff like blink182 simple plan good charlotte bowling for soup new found glory and all that emo shit and greenday u can see that they all derived from the good ol' days eh? stuff copied from like the ramones or sex pistols etc etc. well i duno wat this kind of "new" punk will derive into in the near future and true punk like the street punks and oi punks will be forgotten lol
 
Heres my 2 and a half cents worth of "Punk 101" :D

Punk Music (discussed in previous replies) did indeed start of with rock and roll. Perhaps the first rock and roll artist in which have elevated rock and roll to a higher level would be Elvis Presley in which sometimes known as 'the first white man to black black man's music.' Elvis brought ideas of rebellion to the white suburban middle class. His music wasn't new. It had been in the black community for a long time. A white person was just not supposed to do it. He was being a rebel. He inspired many artists to pick up this new/old music style of the time called rock ‘n’ roll.

"Elvis and rock 'n' roll was the start of the US relationship with the UK music scene which would see us trade sounds and ideas... Rock'n'roll brought the birth of the teenager and as such brought the idea of teenage rebellion and a desire to forge your own identity through clothes and music."
(American Hardcore: A Tribal History)

Some members in which Elvis had inspired were The Who, The Beatles and The Rolling Stones (Early 60's) in whom were into the whole idea of rebellion. This was known during that era as the 'British Invasion' due to the fact that they were all british and we increasingly gaining in popularity and commercial viability. The Velvet Underground was born within that same era in New York with front man Lou Reed. He was known as the Godfather of Punk (though not a punk band), as he laid the foundation of the american movement of punk music.

"Jimmy Osterberg was playing drums in a blues band in Detroit. He moved to Chicago to study his music idols' styles. One night he went to a
party and got high on marijuana. That is when he decided to do blues his own way"
(McNeil and McCain 37)

Jimmy Osterberg formed his owned band called 'The Stooges", After Jimmy was refered more and more to his nickname, that he got from his first band, 'The Iguanas', he finally named his band and of course himself; 'Iggy Pop and the Stooges'

"Iggy heard The Velvet Underground at a party. At First he hated them, but after a while, it sunk in. He was hearing people that were making
good music without being good musicians."
(Dorston)

Iggy and the Stooges didn't know the the common music guidelines in composition, however, they know that music could drive people to tremendous extremes. On stage, The Stooges were like wild animals in a small cage. Iggy Pop would cut himself with broken bottles, cover himself in peanut butter, and throw raw hamburger at the audience. Sometimes Iggy would have to go to the Emergency Room to get stitches in his deeper wounds after a concert. The were tremendously popular, and are probably the first punk band, as some might argue. However, due to bad record sales, the jumped from one record label to another, and due to the combination of bad sales, drug abuse and big ego's; they shortly become broke and burnt out.

"The MC5 was another band from Detroit with the same style of music as they were bored and wrote political and speedy songs. They went
along with the popular anti politics of the time, which of course was hippieism. They created the White Panther Party originally as their fan club,
but it became so much more. Their followers were full of ideas of anarchy and drugs. Eventually the band got tired of the hippie commune
lifestyle, so their once faithful followers turned on them and called them traitors."
(McNeil and McCain)

The New York Dolls took the idea of anti-establishment, and lifestyle and added the "Sensationalism/glam/flamboyence" factor into it. They would tell Nazi jokes or throw-up on stage. They had the guts to try to make their audience mad at them, to make a crowd of drunk people hate them, almost forcing their audience to love them for their courage. Many people liked the New York Dolls because they made rock easy. When the New York Dolls became less popular, the hired Malcom McLaren as manager to help salvage their careers. He knew that shock was very important to this type of band's show. So he dressed them up in red, rubber jump suits and had them adopt communist ideals and put that in their shows. Although The New York Dolls were still very popular, the band split up while on tour due to drug addiction, and Malcom went back to London with some new ideas. The States however had a commercial punk success under its belt with Poet Patti Smith, in which had decided to form a band to "perform her poems". This proved to be a success and in whom sold out concerts and became extremely popular.

"Once Pattie didn’t see where she was going and danced off stage. She broke her neck, but she had no permanent injuries. Many of the people in other bands would see her after that and realize that they are mortals. The Pattie Smith Group broke up when Pattie decided to get married and become a housewife."
(McNeil and McCain 367-372)

Of these, gave birth to The Ramones in whom during that time were bored teenagers watching bands play in clubs. Inspired, they formed the band and played short, hard and fast tunes. They toured England where they were even more accepted then in the New York City. The Ramone's legacy led to inspire bands like; The Clash and The Sex Pistols. The Ramones continued playing all the way till 1991 and are in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. The Ramones are more commonly known as the first Punk band as they were featured in the 1st issue of Punk Magazine, along with Lou Reed. Punk Magazine gave Punk music its name.

After managing The New York Dolls, McLaren wanted to start something like that to U.K. He organized and managed The Sex Pistols. The British youth loved them over "clean, wholesome" music. Malcom McLaren was looking for something to exploit. He decided to use punk because of its rugged appeal and strange style. He found members of The Sex Pistols because of their rough exterior. He made them famous. The Sex Pistols were more of a commercial success then any of their predecessors, except Pattie Smith.
Malcom McLaren made punk famous. (The first boy band?) 8O

There so many streams/sub-cultures in Punk Music even from the beginning. Now, we have Punk, Punk Rock, Pop Punk, Power Punk, Anarcho Punk, Crust Punk, Emo Punk, Mall-Core, Hardcore Punk, the list just goes on and on. The way I see it is that the taste for music and music itself evolves. It happened in the start and always will. The punk culture was a borrowed idea from anti-govt thoughts, anti-estab ideals coupled with the shock factor and sensationalism.

I think I have pretty much dissected the history of Punk Music. I left out the entire postpunk period (early 80's) cos I think it's nothing much to talk about. Do correct me if I have misquoted anything within this article.

I myself play in a punk rock band. However, (I feel) there is a difference between the music and the culture. Perhaps I am a Posuer (some might say) but I'm doing it for the fact that I like the entire structure of how punk music is written in. I just like listening to it. Period.

As for the culture? I honestly don't know, I'm born chinese and am chinese. Does this mean I have to play for the lion dance troupe? That's my culture right? So if I was to "borrow" the culture of punk, does that mean I'm punk?
Just something to ponder on...

Cheers!
Dean
 
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