Needed advice for Nafa Junior Music

[DoubleBlade]

Cheez : Actually I was referring to parents in today's modern society. I mean if a child can show some interest in piano music at the tender age of 2-4 , by all means send him/her for piano lessons. That is what I call as a sensible investment. Investing your money in piano lessons for your child who has developed an interest in music is perfectly fine with me , in fact I am for it because you are doing it for a right cause but what I was referring to is parents who know that their child shows no interest in music at such a tender age and yet send him/her for piano lessons just to show off to their relatives and proclaim to them that their child is "talented" because he/she can play the piano at such a tender age.

Sometimes when I see kids at the age of around 4 hanging out at piano shops playing the pianos on display , I stop and wonder , "Did the parent of this kid force him/her to take piano lessons against his/her free will?" If that is the case , then my deepest sentiments goes out to that kid....

Besides Cheez , I think both you and your parents did the right thing when it comes to giving your child music lessons because if I've recalled correctly , you mentioned that you played a tune from a chinese drama on your toy keyboard which evantually landed you a place in Yamaha by your parents? Truthfully speaking , not many kids at the age of 3-4 could play by ear unless they are naturally talented. Your parents did the right choice to folk out money from their hard earned cash reserves to pay for your lessons because they knew you had something "special" towards music. That is what I see as a sensible investment parents can do to their child. Same goes to your kids as well , trying to expose them to music and getting them interested in music at same time first before sending them for music lessons is what a parent should do in trying to enrol their child for music lessons. If the child still has no interest in music even with lots of exposure , we should just let it be and not force the child into taking music lessons.

Oh well...I don't think you have to worry about your kids when it comes to music because it's all in the genes....

 

[mingguan]

...Cheez , ... you mentioned that you played a tune from a chinese drama on your toy keyboard which evantually landed you a place in Yamaha by your parents?

Wah!!! didn't aware that Cheez have this type of "background".
Sounds familliar,
I remember when I was still kids (before I entered Kindergarten),
I don't why my mother buy me a toy piano (made by wood).
then I everyday play and play, until it spoilt, then my mother scold me very hard , but still buy me another one... :wink: I remember that time i play "Happy Birthday", "London bridge..."...etc.
Until I primary 2 then my mother send me to learn piano (YAMAHA also).
but I dropped it after 1 year as I found that it too boring (and I also lazy...), watch cartoon at home better.

3 years later I regret i didn't continue at that time.
But i not dare to beg my mum to send me to learn piano again (sure kena scold...),
thus i requestted to learn electone...learnt & learnt... almost 11 years liao, until i complete my poly & dropped it. too bad. I'm not talented.

Hm...
Cheez, Play by ear = Perfect Pitch? :wink:

 

[ShredCow]

Yea and one more thing, i don't believe in grades, after grade 6 theory, i don't wanna take ABRSM syllabus liao, now i learning piano and theory stuff from a teacher preparing me to go berklee next year .. So it doesn't matter if your child doesn't have high grades, if she has the interest, its all good. Example, although i have many friends which are higher in grade, they don't know anything bout composing and such stuff, they only know such thing as practical and theory exams, and how to play fast ..

I think this thing abt the grading should be taken with a pinch of salt. The Grading will not mean you are a fabulous musician, but what type of musician are you talking abt?

Teraslasch, I get the vibe you are talking about contemporary musicians. People who value improvisation.

On the other hand, classical musicians seek to emulate, to be as best an imitator of the piece they are playing. If they are excellent classical players, then they can somehow add in an element of their own taste/flavour into the piece. Improvisation is not at the forefront of classical music.

So I see your comments abt your classical friends are very lopsided. This is what I get from the words you use lah. I used to have a classically trained friend, a prodigy. He is incredible and does classical concert in Esplanade. When he came to MDC, he was bad at improvisation. Does that make him a bad musician? In anycase, in the end he picked up really quick... near perfect pitch and insane speed , throw that to jazz... he might not get the "feel" of a contemporary jazz pianist but he sure imitates it well.

All in all I would say, yes, still, you getting high grades don't mean you are an extraordinary musician but its a mark, a standard nonetheless. Its good to have and having it does mean something, that you were able to reach that mark.

Or of course, just forgo the grades and jump to berklee. Heh.

 

[teraslasch]

Or of course, just forgo the grades and jump to berklee. Heh.

I love that line LOL.. hahaha... but my teacher tell me better that jazz exam before i go haha..

 

[kiasuma]

Hi cheez - Thanks alot for the great information! You have a point there, I shouldn't be exam focused (Sad to say that the society here is). Nafa Junior music course offers exam in every six mth, so if the child can follow thru, will complete grade 5 in 2 & a half yr. Ofcourse the big question is "Whether the child can really do it??"

Yoo teraslasch - Thanks for sharing your story! Glad to hear after your 'hatred' for the piano, you managed to find your way back on track with it again.

Hey Doubleblade - Most of my friends send their kids to Yamaha at age 3plus. Me too wondering if those kids are being dragged by their parent to the class. I only started my elder gal last year cause she said she would like to learn how to play a piano. When asked why, she said she wanted to play a birthday song for me on my birthday. I was so touched.... She started in mid Jan 2005, completed the basic book in 8 lessons, & the grade 1 book in 10 lessons. She stopped in may, due to my other commitment (no time to bring her to class). Started lesson again with this current new teacher last oct. So in actual fact, she has less than 10mths of experience in piano as of now. This current teacher encourage her to go for grade 2 exam this oct.

mingguan - you very funny leh....tell story started from Part II 1st then continue with Part I . But I enjoyed reading every word of it. Tks!

After gathering all the advices from the many kind souls here, I am giving it a serious second thought....... really appreciate the stories that you have shared & all the valuable advices & opinions. I would definitely stick around even thou I'm not really a musically inclined person but am sure I have a buried music soul...LOL Tks again!!

 

[mingguan]

kiasuma, i am a typical example of failure, do aware of it... :lol: :lol: :lol:

P/S: part II then part I? eh... initially malu to let people know I stop piano just because of want to watch cartoon at home...

 

[Cheez]

Yea and one more thing, i don't believe in grades, after grade 6 theory, i don't wanna take ABRSM syllabus liao...

Teraslasch, exams are not everything but they are also not nothing... if you get my idea. I think the same goes for O levels, A levels, degree, postgrade exams etc etc - exams help us find out what we need to know, what we still don't know, see if we really know what we should know etc. I guess the same applies for studies - if we go for exams for the sake of exams, then it also missed the purpose of education. This is sadly true of today's education system (at least in Singapore). I think there's a move away from this - hopefully Singapore improves in this area.

My suggestion for you is to go on to grade 8 if possible. Many games soundtracks nowadays applies orchestration to it (like film music) - as you are already doing now. And harmony theory is a very important component to this type of writing. Harmony in Grade 8 is really more advanced than harmony in grade 6. Take it not for the sake of getting the grade, but for improving your writing skills. After Grade 8, then you can go more into orchestration. But Harmony is the basis for almost everything in music writing - can't do without it! I apply it to everything I write and arrange, although I'm still learning how to do it better.


Kiasuma, do tell us your decision. My son is younger than your daughter - so I'm interested to follow the progress of your daughter. I'm thrilled to hear that she is picking up piano fast. I'm now thinking whether I want to get my younger son to also pick up the piano or another instrument. Piano is good because it is versatile - however I don't want to create competition and comparison between my children, which may happen if they play the same instrument.

 

[teraslasch]

yea cheez, point taken, i may take grade 8 theory, but not practical.. haha.. starting to learn more and more about harmonization and stuff.. Btw, grade 8 and 6 theory, difficulty difference? is it a wide gap?

 

[Cheez]

Sure, there will be difference in difficulty. But I don't think it's that tough. I really believe it will benefit you greatly, seeing the type of music you are writing. You're already very gifted in this area - more theory will surely help! Agree - Grade 8 practical is not that practical (no pun intended) in your case.

 

[DoubleBlade]

1 question : Is harmony anywhere related to chord voicing?

 

[Cheez]

Yes, they are related. But we are hijacking this thread. Better start another thread if you want to discuss this further.

 

[teraslasch]

Sure, there will be difference in difficulty. But I don't think it's that tough. I really believe it will benefit you greatly, seeing the type of music you are writing. You're already very gifted in this area - more theory will surely help! Agree - Grade 8 practical is not that practical (no pun intended) in your case.

Yea, theory is very important to me haha.. especially when im going to do orchestration next time. Lol, yea and i agre grade 8 practical is not practical for me o.o, i'll prolly fail coz im too lazy to practice hahaha.. :lol:

 

[kiasuma]

Kiasuma, do tell us your decision. My son is younger than your daughter - so I'm interested to follow the progress of your daughter. I'm thrilled to hear that she is picking up piano fast. I'm now thinking whether I want to get my younger son to also pick up the piano or another instrument. Piano is good because it is versatile - however I don't want to create competition and comparison between my children, which may happen if they play the same instrument.

Hey Cheez - Nafa's audition is twice a year, May & Nov. I think I will still let her go for the audition in May, also to registered her for the grade 2 exam in Oct. At the main time I will gather more infor from the parents who kids are already in the course. I am thinking of going over to the school to talk to parents who are there waiting around for their kids to finish piano lesson (very kiasu hor... ). So if she pass the audition, I would have come out with a decision already.

As for your sons, what if your younger son is more interested/talented in paino than other instruments?. He is still very young, I'm sure you will find out sooner or later if he has a flair in piano. If a child can take the competition/comparison positively, it is not a bad thing at all, it can be a motivation for each other to do better. This infact need to be nurture, excepting failure with positive attitude. Both my girls is 4yrs apart, the elder one learn how to encourage the younger one to keep up with her.

 

[Cheez]

As for your sons, what if your younger son is more interested/talented in paino than other instruments?. He is still very young, I'm sure you will find out sooner or later if he has a flair in piano. If a child can take the competition/comparison positively, it is not a bad thing at all, it can be a motivation for each other to do better. This infact need to be nurture, excepting failure with positive attitude. Both my girls is 4yrs apart, the elder one learn how to encourage the younger one to keep up with her.

Thanks for that! I hope I can do that well! My sister dropped piano because of competition with me - so I know from bad experience how terrible it can be. At the moment, the older is just trying to kill the younger! And boys can be quite a handful! Good to hear that your older daughter is actually encouraging the younger. Any tips? We're reading books on sibling rivalry. I was told that one never become a true parent unless he/she has 2 or more children...

 

[teraslasch]

lol , my sis is , 3 years older than me haha, we all ARE LAZYYY =p.. last time always nv practice teacher scold both of us haha.. but later on like grade 4-5 she failed twice in a row so.. lol.. she dropped .. whereas i always manage to SCRAPEE by a few marks :lol: .. was really funny.. =p

 

[kiasuma]

At the moment, the older is just trying to kill the younger! And boys can be quite a handful!

Hahaha.......I can imagine.....

I was told that one never become a true parent unless he/she has 2 or more children...

Agree totally with your above statement. Me too have a looooong way to learn.

Any tips? We're reading books on sibling rivalry.

I'm not too sure of bringing up boys....I've two girls. I think it is tougher than bringing up girls, somehow girls are more 'tame'....you know what I mean. But I do pay alot of attention in two Quotient - EQ & most importantly their AQ.

Below are what I hv got from somewhere & find it very useful.

AQ, is the science of human resilience. People with high AQ respond to challenges better, faster & perform optimally in the face of adversity.

Children with optimistic thinking skills are better able to interpret failure, have a stronger sense of personal mastery and are better able to bounce back when things go wrong in their lives.

How Parents Can Help
Step 1: Learn to think optimistically yourself.
Step 2: Teach your child that there is a connection between how they think and how they feel. You can do this most easily by saying aloud how your own thoughts about adversity create negative feelings in you.
Step 3: Create a game called 'thought catching.' This helps your child learn to identify the thoughts that flit across his or her mind at the times they feel worst. These thoughts, although barely noticeable, greatly affect mood and behavior.
For instance, if your child received a poor grade, ask: "When you got your grade, what did you say to yourself?"
Step 4: Teach your child how to evaluate automatic thoughts. This means acknowledging that the things they say to themself are not necessarily accurate.
For instance, after receiving the poor grade your child may be telling himself he is a failure, he is not as smart as other kids; he will never be able to succeed in school, etc. Many of these self-statements may not be accurate, but they are 'automatic' in that situation.
Step 5: Instruct your child on how to generate more accurate explanations (to themselves) when bad things happen and use them to challenge your child's automatic but inaccurate thoughts. Part of this process involves looking for evidence to the contrary (good grades in the past, success in other life areas, etc).
Another skill to teach your child to help him or her think optimistically is to 'decatastrophize' the situation - that is - help your child see that the bad event may not be as bad or will not have the adverse consequences imagined. Few things in life are as devastating as we fear, yet we blow them up in our minds.

Parents can influence the thinking styles of their children by modeling the principals of optimistic thinking.

 

[Cheez]

Kiasuma, that's very helpful and interesting. Thanks!

 

[DoubleBlade]

Kiasuma :
Do give us an update on your daughter's progress as and when you have the time. I'm sure we would like to know how is she going so far....

 

[kiasuma]

Hi Doubleblade & everyone,

My gal has passed the audition last Sunday. She is accepted by NAFA for the gifted Young pianists course. The person incharged mentioned that, 30% who went for the audition got accepted, am glad my gal is one of the lucky one. She is very excited about it too.

I happened to come across this mum who her daughter is already in this course, she was very kind to invite me for the master class in NAFA. I brought my gal along & she loved it.

After the audition, she was so excited about playing on a grand piano. She said the sound from the Grand piano is so much nicer.

Thank you for all the advices, informations & experiences that you have shared.

 

[ShredCow]

Oh that is SWEET!
I hope your child loves music thru out her life. An invaluable God given gift music is.