Long hair for school going guys petition

[hifi_killer]

sweeping generalisation #1 " individuality is the celebration of the human intellect, collectivism is the direct opposite, it kills the beauty of the human mind".

individualism and collectivism are culture specific. Collectivism in Japanese society has encourage much more innovation, than the individualist american society.

sweeping generalisation #2
" It(Asian values) condones the act of suppressing the individual"

Humanism exists widely in Asian culture and values.

Take for example even traditional confucianism encourages the empowerment, self actualisation of individuals through education regardless of social-economic class. Like wise in the taoism emphasis of self.

not to mention, many western values had asian origins.

there are good and bad things in every culture. Unfortunately, your inherently bias perception of your own kind resulted in u failing to notice the positive aspects.

sweeping generalisation #3
" If I agreed to follow a restrictive and undoubtedly asinine system of rules, I would not only be insulting my intelligence, I would be creating an environment where oppression becomes the norm.
"

What you think of as restrictive and asinine is purely subjective
Marx contends that control is given not only by oppression but influence (both good and bad) too. There are people who respect genuinely respect the rules, they aren't necessary oppressed.

By aliens i mean dont mean the liberals. i meant being treated like an alien, a second class citizen.

Cant help it but notice the term ' oppression ' has been thrown around too loosely. In singapore its more of a societal pressure, peer pressure and the pressure to make a living, rather than a top -down political oppression

 

[luxen-ilyich]

4. What is so misguided about Asian beliefs?

It is such misguided for at its core it condemns the very change so essential for the progression of society.

In such one might notice that few systems are superior than others, nor beliefs, nor collective morals.

With such it might so be observed that all ways bear the marks of their boons, and more strikingly, their flaws.

And that neither these goods nor these flaws are forthright or explicit, lest applied to certain situations.

The plenary emphasis on heirachy, for one, most satisfactorily established order in the past ages.

Asian beliefs would have one heedlessly adhere to systems throughout the ages.

Asian culture, among others, urges heightened amounts of fear in an attempt to render its followers helplessly clinging on to ways which bring them security- ways which proved successful in the past.

Such is also known as "conservativeness". To fear the future. To fear the freedom of choice and what consequences it might bring. To fear the very change so essential for the progression of society.

In such way is Asian culture wretched.

 

[hifi_killer]

It is very tempting to chart the progress of society in myopic political terms.
However, progress of society is largely measured in economic, physical and spiritual well-being. Asian values no doubt had a positive influence in these aspects.
Hence, i see Asian values as more of guiding, than misguiding

 

[luxen-ilyich]

It is very tempting to chart the progress of society in myopic political terms.
However, progress of society is largely measured in economic, physical and spiritual well-being. Asian values no doubt had a positive influence in these aspects.
Hence, i see Asian values as more of guiding, than misguiding

To the blind.

Not a soul here condemned Asian culture to complete uselessness.

If you will not think before you argue you will receive no answer from those who will.

 

[Hydrofly]

"Individualism and collectivism are culture specific. Collectivism in Japanese society has encourage much more innovation, than the individualist american society."

Notice the time period, Japan seems to have run into a a roadblock in terms of innovation. Their greatest period of innovation in Japan happened to be when the Japanese imperial government made and effort to import western ideas and talent. Coincidence? I think not.

"Take for example even traditional confucianism encourages the empowerment, self actualisation of individuals through education regardless of social-economic class. Like wise in the taoism emphasis of self."

My ass. Traditional confucianism is a huge problem in the world today, this is as it forces the individual ideas down and forces the individual to 'go with the flow', or rather, conform to the ideals of the social group.

"By aliens i mean dont mean the liberals. i meant being treated like an alien, a second class citizen."

Shows how many people you really know... Stop hiding in your hole, start knowing more people from around the world.

edit: You will be treated as a second class citizen if you behave like one, as you are right now.

 

[hifi_killer]

Not a soul here condemned Asian culture to complete uselessness.

i surprised you interpreted my opinions in that manner.

 

[luxen-ilyich]

Think! Damn you think!

 

[hifi_killer]

Notice the time period, Japan seems to have run into a a roadblock in terms of innovation. Their greatest period of innovation in Japan happened to be when the Japanese imperial government made and effort to import western ideas and talent. Coincidence? I think not.

Incorrect. Japan are at the forefront of consumer based technology now, despite economic stagnation.

My ass. Traditional confucianism is a huge problem in the world today, this is as it forces the individual ideas down and forces the individual to 'go with the flow', or rather, conform to the ideals of the social group.

huge problem? Generalisation again.

I'm not denying the short comings of confucianism, i'm just trying broaden up the the different perspectives, something which you as GP student failed to do.

 

[hifi_killer]

To the blind.

for the record , its more blind to ignore the other perspectives.

There are psychologist who had strong empirical and scientific backing to show that freedom is nothing more than an illusion of the conscious mind.

 

[snuffleupagus]

Singaporeans NEED to grow up, if you play by the rules, prepare to be left by the wayside. It's a rat race out there, either you step on people, or people will step on you, on the ladder to greatness, if you don't see people as rungs, you won't have no ladder.

Hohoh...So you're 17 and you sound like you've seen it all? Please come back here and post in 10 years time (from your adopted western country) and tell us if there's any views you may wish to edit here.

All the older dudes here have been through the 17 yr old rebel-with-a-cause stage in our lives, and things change my friend, for everyone.

I do admire your fighting spirit and I find many of your posts hilarious, and I wish you well! However I am subscribing to your theory of non-conformity by not conforming to the views of your demography because hey, non-conformance is cool and not for only NOFX fans. In fact I will disagree to agree whenever I can.

Cheers.

 

[Hydrofly]

Incorrect. Japan are at the forefront of consumer based technology now, despite economic stagnation.


huge problem? Generalisation again.

I'm not denying the short comings of confucianism, i'm just trying broaden up the the different perspectives, something which you as GP student failed to do.

Indeed, however, my persistence has yet to cause me to get anything less than a B for GP. I believe that the objective of an argumentative essay to completely quash all possible opposition.

=Snuffle
Yea definitely. 10 years from now... All my hard work with my studies better start paying off.

 

[halfastepdown]

Hydrofly, so you studying hard to beat the system or to be part of the system?

Hmm because the system which you are so against created this education system.

You're 17 man, so behave like one. Have fun.

 

[Hydrofly]

I'm studying hard to beat the system, for now, if i fight it head on, I will lose, plain and simple. If I study hard and do well, I will be valued. Life sucks, it works that way. When I'm valued, I can go anywhere I want. Do you think simply being a university graduate is enough? No. If I don't do well enough, I will get my ass flung back to Singapore. If you think just because you're older than me you can tell me to behave as I should, so can I. Stop telling me to stop chasing my dreams because unlike you, I celebrate my intelligence by having an opinion and the desire, and the drive.

From what I'm seeing, there seems to be rampant youthanasia, if you don't plan to take me seriously based purely on age, I shall then decide that you have been incapacitated by the debilitating effects of senility and old age, thus voiding all your previous arguments. If there is nothing wrong with youthanasia, there is nothing wrong with ageism am I right?

 

[luxen-ilyich]

Well Spoken.

 

[l0stwhispers]

individualism and collectivism are culture specific. Collectivism in Japanese society has encourage much more innovation, than the individualist american society.

Yes, I don't disagree that Japanese has much more innovation than America. But you have to look at the way collectivism has dug holes in their culture as well. Look at the cram schools that they've got. I've seen a documentary on it and how students are not allowed to leave until they've passed a test or meet some other criteria. Some even stay at the cram school for days on end. And also the sociological phenomenon by the name of Hikikomori, where people just withdraw totally from society because of the pressure to conform, to attain the goals the collectivist society has set for them. Because of ranking and different classes, not everyone's able to attain these goals, so not everyone can conform. So yea, I guess my point is just that, collectivism isn't always good.

 

[l0stwhispers]

Hohoh...So you're 17 and you sound like you've seen it all? Please come back here and post in 10 years time (from your adopted western country) and tell us if there's any views you may wish to edit here.

All the older dudes here have been through the 17 yr old rebel-with-a-cause stage in our lives, and things change my friend, for everyone.

Yea, hydrofly's still 17 and yes, he may still be a tad immature, but he has the right to rebel if he wants to in my opinion.

I personally elected to head overseas to further my education and to see what other societies are like because Singapore was getting a bit too oppressive and restrictive for me. I've been in Melbourne for 2 years, and it's been pretty much like heaven. Pardon the cheesiness, but I reckon life's been so much better for me. I've had the time to reflect and the time to find my own place in the society. I'm not saying Australia's the best place in the world, it has its faults, but as compared to Singapore, I reckon it's a better place.

 

[Hydrofly]

its more blind

Is it actually possible to use a varying marker on an absolute condition such as blindness? Just a thought... Well, if you do represent the majority of the Singaporean population, little wonder most of them come scurrying back after 3 years overseas.

 

[hifi_killer]

Indeed, however, my persistence has yet to cause me to get anything less than a B for GP. I believe that the objective of an argumentative essay to completely quash all possible opposition.

I see.
So i guess that reflects a fundamental flaw of the education system? Education is supposed to broaden your horizons and perspective. the inability to consider other perspective would in fact be a regression in education.

 

[Hydrofly]

Since our education system is flawed, then I guess 5 years schooling in another country would rectify that . My horizons are more than broad enough, I read confucius' analects as a child, I failed to understand it. I read them again as I entered secondary school, I failed to understand it. I read it again as I entered Junior College, then I saw the light, it is but a tool with which to control people with.

Like what Luxen said, start thinking. You start off backing the entire system, now you shoot yourself in the foot. Your discretion is overwhelming.

 

[luxen-ilyich]

Mr. hifi-killer appears to have moved the issue in consideration away from the topics at hand.

In questioning hydrofly's credibility he engages in personal attacks, of which further appear regressively contradictory.

I urge Mr.hifi-killer once more to either engage in some level of volition or to abandon his trifling attempts at self-glorification.

Hydrofly has made a clear and justified case for his beliefs. It is time he starts doing the same.