Even in flood, India's `untouchables' last rescued

[zachary]

You are most welcome. It is good that you inquire more.Because like i said,such constructive mind with it's thinking capability will only help you to gain further knowledge and understand spirit as well as matters.I am not frustrated as to whether i lack understanding of my faith.The points are clear and i even gave quotes derived from Bagavad Gita cause someone challenged me. Regarding "Shudras are prone to be more sinful than Brahmins",it is the genes at work.We can argue forever and i know Islam preached equality too but just take a look around you and examine it with a cool mind like what you have.Example,what are the entertainments of certain types of people who does certain types of work.You will know what i mean.I am glad you open yourself up in this holy month of Ramadhan. You will be rewarded unknowingly by the Lord.

again u mentioned genes.... pray tell me where are ur scientific proofs. post them up and back it up. cos if not they're just empty words

 

[martel]

Bro, I was meaning to say that you are frustrated by Other people's lack of understanding of your faith. Not about you lacking understanding. You are definitely knowledgeable enough, or at least more knowledgeable than me heh.

You too can become knowledgable if you enquire more about the caste system like what you did so far. People not born in india is not subjected to Castes because it is not within the context.Thoa,laws are just in koran too,spiritual laws are there so as to keep in check the level of intelligence of a certain group of people.And there are different types of educations too i don't want to go into that.But what makes someone more intelligent than others is also evident in the way they post.

 

[martel]

I think basically we can stop at here because at this rate it is going,lesser intelligent questions are bound to come up and eventually someone will ask me to "prove where is God/lord Vishnu". I have answered Thoa with right answers and he is satisfied. There is no need to carry on.

 

[zachary]

Vimal,i don't look down on you due to the fact of your caste type.But without proper knowledge and simply cut and copy from sources which is totally untrue,i welcome you to know the real india. India's invasion by Aryans is a myth,Caste system are from time immemorials.There exist caste system long before any 'invasions' happens.

n ur sources r true??? gee do u have a time machine??? damn can i borrow it pls.... wanna say hello to my ancestors

 

[THOA]

I would like to make some request if I may.

Martel: Would it be ok if I request that in your next prayer, to pray for all Hindus, regardless of caste, to be able to have better next life? I'm sure it will reflect well into your karma. I'm hoping that it might be possible.

All other Hindu/non-Hindu bros and sis: I would like request that you refrain from getting too personal in your arguments. As much as I agree with some of you, there are certain things about a man's faith and believe that just cannot be changed and I think there is no point to condemn. Whatever the truth may be, I hope we can live long enough to witness it.

Mods: I have found my answer, so would it be any trouble to have this thread locked?

 

[martel]

=THOA



It is my duty to pray not only for them but also for you because you have exhibited Brahminical quality from your non-anger,clean mindset with a positive inquisitive mindset. I pray that your fasting is a success and may you go closer to Allah and gain wisdom.

 

[zachary]

really now
less intelligent questions... i sure hope ur not talking bout me brudder cos all im asking bout is proofs of the so called DNA mollecular structure difference between brahmins n sudra tt u keep spouting about. since u keep talking bout genetic flaws in a sudra's DNA makeup, i just wanna see evidence since analysing of DNA can be done IF u actually have access to it or u actually are a doctor or a genetic scientist. proving whether or not GOD exists is a totally different matter altogether, while DNA analysis is not a myth

but i dun think u r are u. so pls do urself and us a favour, pls stop spouting nonsense bout DNA or genetic flaws in a person unless u can prove it

 

[zachary]

i apologise if it seems tt im attacking anyone's belief but to me any comments bout genetics or DNA makeup shld be backed up with scientific evidence n not be spouted about by someone who has no idea wat they're talking bout

 

[visa]

it disturbs me how religion has the power to overcome logic.

 

[bluepowder]

I am quite glad I got into this thread before it got locked...I dont generally get involved in these discussions...but I love my country.....and its quite disgusting to see it being dragged through the mud.....

To Thoa the OP: Please disregard the large amounts of absolute bullshit in this thread...posted mainly on the part of Martel....if you really do have questions about the caste system, feel free to pm me about them....but before you do so, do have a read of "Brave New World" to better understand why god invented the class system and why humans invented the caste system....

To all of Soft: How much more Racial profiling(which is against the law btw) must this thread be put through before you realize that Martel is a troll...

First things first....all props to Vimal and many others for standing up for what Hinduism is really about...

Martel: its one thing to stand up for what you believe in, its a whole other thing to drag our country's name through the mud with our ridiculous fanatical views which are based on non-factual evidence

The class system was not invented with any sort of blood or DNA system in mind, if you knew anything about hinduism you would know that Moksha is achieved only through doing good deeds throughout your life...and these deeds were defined differently for different class...it was a very efficient way of ensuring that all jobs in a society have been taken care of.....

Secondly it is absolute bullshit that the lower castes/classes are less intelligent by any means or that they do not deserve to receive a good education....

If you actually knew what you are talking about you would know that not only in parliament but more importantly in all educational institutions in india, there is a very large quota reserved for what are known as the lower castes or the tribes....India is fighting hard to raise the education level and help everyone succeed....moreso to the fact that many Brahmins CHANGE their caste to a lower caste to avail of this reservation....that would tell you the weightage of the caste system vs the education system.....

IF you also had lived in India at any time and knew what life was like in India you would know the level of atrocities committed by any caste...brahmins included in india....it is absolutely ridiculous....from all the way to the abuse of the lower castes to all out murder....a Crime committed out of spite and racism(by the upper castes) is far worse than a crime committed out of need....for food...to survive.(frm the lower castes)...I am not justifying either...but any man of sane mind will understand what i am saying....

The racial profiling grew so strong in india many 100s and 1000s of years ago that the wealth disparity grew more and more....obviously since the brahmins were assigned with the task of knowledge and were hence paid well....this permeated down over the years so that many lower castes are born into poverty....with this social and racial profiling and generations of lower castes being denied education.....DUE A HUMAN INVENTED CASTE SYSTEM...the lower class(especialy the untouchables)....had no education regarding family planning...etc...having many children was not uncommon....and with the lower wages as compared to brahmins....generations of untouchables wer forced to work only in menial jobs to feed themselves...its a vicious circle if you think about it...

BUT people just dont understand...that Caste and Class are a different issue...what people are referring to as Caste as Brahmin,Vaishya etc is not caste but in fact a Class...which was state in the manusmriti(the book of laws)...the CASTE SYSTEM WAS JUST A SOCIAL PRACTICE INVENTED BY HUMANS, IT IS NOT A RELIGIOUS ONE.

The teachings of Vishnu state that all Men are born equal and that class is not decided by birth but by your actions, actions are not decided by your blood but by yourself and you environment....however this was translated into a caste system and the choices of the father started carrying on to the son....racial profiling...ugh...

Oh and the whole statement of the "dark skinned south indians, some of them being brahmin"....its quite sad that behind this virtual facade i cannot make you eat your own words...but south india has one of the largest number of brahmins in India...so (a) you are wrong there(b) South India is also the most literate part of India with a very large non-brahmin population( so your hypothesis on the lower castes not being literate is bullshit) and (c) this sentence made me realize that you either not indian or do indeed come from the shame of India(Bihar)....I rarely see this sort of mindset and Klu Klux blood purist mentality in India, even 2 generations ago our forefather had much more respect for all Indians....

Before you ask...Im Indian....I am from the supposedly elite Brahmin caste...and I dont give a shit about it...

This post was intended mainly to shed light on the kind of bullshit thats tarnishing the image of India....Yes the caste system is still prevalant in many parts of india...the difference...do not compare India to Singapore...I come from one of the smaller towns in India that is about 3 times the size of Singapore....the kind of size being talked about puts Singapore and India on a different plane of comparison....the racism is bad...the practices are atrocious...but reforming the mind of a billion people takes a few generations...and India is making progress....I have faced Racism many a time in Singapore....just for being Indian....in university, in hotels, just standing on the road....racism is present all over the world....its easy to comment on it....but you will never know the truth till you experience it yourself....the random chaotic nature of racism....

Its the duty of all humans(especially the ones granted a free pass at birth) to ensure goodwill for the other man(fortunate or less fortunate)......such racist profiling will not be tolerated.....

Once again....I reiterate...the Caste system was invented by Man...not God....

 

[THOA]

Bluepowder, your post reflected a lot of my personal perspectives.

I pmed you.

 

[guitarsan]

Bluepowder - great post, which explains everything and makes lots of sense.

Now, let's close this freakin' thread before martel got a chance to "defend" his racist, perversed and twisted ideology!

 

[rottenramone]

guitarsan: let's not add our value judgement into what martel truly believes in shall we? if he truly believes in it, that's his interpretation of the religion, so be it. it is hard to change hearts and minds when personal beliefs are involved.

martel: u have the freedom to choose whatever interpretation of religion. let's go back to the floods, shall we? let's say that everyone accepted their place in caste, would the perfectly casted civilization rescue whoever first, or the upper castes get rescued first? logically it would be everyone gets equal attention as all castes are a part of a whole.

if the sweepers are drowned, will a brahmin sweep?

 

[zachary]

bluepowder- good post tt. thank u. esp bout the DNA part. pretty much sums up what i'm trying to say.

 

[nosepicker]

You are wrong,Caste system is the most wonderful thing the Lord has ever invented,and if you just follow accordingly,whether you be a brahmin or sudras,then life will flow smoothly. You can choose not to be a cleaner,just serve the other castes faithfully and wait for your lifespan to be over,then by the mercy of Bhagawan you may be reborn again not as lower than human.

The Nazis and KKK sure felt they were right too

 

[wyldeboon]

martel: i totally do not understand wat u r saying in the 12 pages...

wateva it is...
where is my boon tong kee chicken rice?


lastly...

everyone is born equal and have the same chances as everyone else.
be it u r from a lower caste or higher...
be it my dad is a murderer...
be it tat my ancestors aren't musicians...
be it my DNA shows tat i'm Hitler's great great great great great great great grandson...

you r still human. everyone deserves the same respect,opportunities n help.

 

[tim098]

Bluepowder, thank you for your post. I hope martel responds to it, I would like to see what one, with such a perspective on hinduism such as him, has to say after that twelve pages of twisted contradiction.

 

[guitarsan]

On a side note.....Singapore has its own unique brand of caste system too. It's called ELITISM.....propagated from years of PAP's "survival-of-the-fittest" policies. Not in terms of physical segregation, but more of social disparity, academic standings, financial & professional status and attitudes.

 

[tim098]

bear in mind why sudras are not allowed to touch scriptures,they are not only crimminally inclined but unclean to the core within the DNA cells. Thus,it is the characters which evolved from the DNA structures of the certain castes. Even if someone from the sudra caste were to get a PHD he is and will always be a sudra. That is the stauch point i am making,and even if a brahmin is lazy,still he should be respected in all respect. Understand?

you disgust me so much, it is people like you who will prolong the existence of the caste system, whether explicit or implicit. This here has nothing to do with Hinduism, as clearly proven above. Therefore I see no reason why I shouldn't question your thinking, especially when you are almost forcing it down our throats.

 

[rottenramone]

trust me bro, it ain't as bad as pakistan. was there recently and the class segregation is sooooo in your face. even amongst govt officials there was a huge divide. its quite funny to see a PA having a PA! i still think elitism is a huge problem here in our sunny island, but not as bad as other countries.