Music store etiquette

I'm currently working in a guitar store dealing with miscellaneous paper work. Apart from that, I do help out with sales from time to time.
Seriously man, you need to tell us which store you're working for. It is a matter of great importance.

What I've noticed is that quite a handful if not most Singaporeans (I'm a Singaporean too by the way) have this mindset that a red carpet has to be laid for them the moment they set foot into the store.
You're a Singaporean too? So do you like it when you walk into say a shoe shop and the staff gives you the red carpet treatment? If you do like it, then you're being a little hypocritical, donchathink?

Let this be known that the "Customer is the King" concept does not apply everywhere. It applies for places like Robinsons because that is how they want to run their business.
Yes of cos, thats how they want to run their sensible business, how you want to run your business is also up to you. Keep up the good work!

Being the Manager/Boss of a place, they make the decision whether they want you in or out of the store. Ever wondered why you got chased out in the first place? Were they being plain mean to you or did you do something that forced them to be mean to you? There is a difference there.
Although I am quite appalled by the fact that you think its okay to be mean customers/to chase customers out of the shop under certain circumstances, I am just as disgusted to know that if I do walk into your shop, you/the boss will consciously decide whether you want me in or out of the store? That is so screwed up. You are the one with the high and mighty attitude.

In conclusion, you are going to lose out if you decide to keep that high and mighty attitude of yours. Being a musician, you have to go to music stores to buy things. We have to remember that not every music store is customer orientated. Why should they be when they are going to be on the losing end most of the time? It just isn't worth it.

Your opinions please. Flame only if deemed necessary.

Wow, you can draw up a conclusion from all that bullshit you just made up, I don't get it. I don't get how I will lose out if I don't visit guitar stores to get my gear. I'm just mouse-clicks away from my next K-line.

I will remember that not every music store is customer oriented, but yours is not customer orientated. (because you don't expect customers)

These are my opinions. Flame on!
 
Lol.. This is why this whole argument is so messy and un-end-able in the first place. Stuffs get salted and peppered all over. Yes I don't have a clue whether you seen or not seen. That's why I say "probably" bro.

Don't worry... No bad blood there. Maybe I just forgot to put a smilie... What I was trying to say is that SOPs are SOPs. Store policies are not the same thing. SOPs are set in place so that employees do not mishandle situations, and those situations can lead (in some cases, like mine) to life-threatening circumstances. but corporate policy is more of a framework in which guides the employee to handle situations within a certain degree of flexibility. SOPs are tighter than that. If SOPs can be flexible, then there's no point having SOPs in the first place.

Opinion on customer is king differs to different people. How you want to solve a problem that occurs in a guitar shop is different from every shop owners. Some chose to kick away arrogant customers, some chose to value customer (like me, thus I have an SOP of my own), thus each shop have different policies tailored to their need.

Agreed. In my previous line of work where everything I did spanned across a network of 4 countries and 15 retail stores, I noticed that "customer is king" is a matter of perspective. At the end of the day, it still must make business sense. I can bend over backwards for the customer, but if I'm losing money, then there's no point in meeting the customer's demands. And this was based on items that cost 6 figures yet smaller than your palm.

There is no reason to be rude to a customer. Or is there? There have been times where the customer has been abusive, and purely barbaric in their treatment of my staff (who were paid well enough to withstand abuse; they were paid more than ME!) and worse, my products. Compensating me for a damaged product could easily have cost 2 PRS Private Stock Guitars. Yet you still have customers who insisted on having their way. Those customers are kindly shown the door.

Today, I deal with the customers of Airlines, and 200,000 of them per month at that. And you get some seriously irate passengers who have actually paid $0 for an air ticket, yet expect to be treated like SQ first class! They talk to my staff, who have to clear 2,000 passengers within 30 mins (sound impossible huh?) like they owe them a living. Or like my staff are their slaves. And when my staff don't follow SOP just once, they are terminated. And with all this pressure, my staff are still expected to smile. C'mon man... My guys/girls are human. I don't blame them for losing their patience. But what to do? People still insist that "customer is king".

Don't get me wrong. Generally, the majority of the populace is not like that. But it takes a few bad apples to really spoil your day.

I always remember something: You have a right to extend your fist to where my nose is. But I also have a right not to have my nose bloodied.
 
Summary of thread: Personal accountability is for losers :rolleyes:

I'm out of this thread. I'll live by my own morals: I damage something that does not belong to me, I jolly well compensate the owner, be it a friend or shop, if he/she wants me to and whether or not I am held liable by the law.
 
Agreed. In my previous line of work where everything I did spanned across a network of 4 countries and 15 retail stores, I noticed that "customer is king" is a matter of perspective. At the end of the day, it still must make business sense. I can bend over backwards for the customer, but if I'm losing money, then there's no point in meeting the customer's demands. And this was based on items that cost 6 figures yet smaller than your palm.

There is no reason to be rude to a customer. Or is there? There have been times where the customer has been abusive, and purely barbaric in their treatment of my staff (who were paid well enough to withstand abuse; they were paid more than ME!) and worse, my products. Compensating me for a damaged product could easily have cost 2 PRS Private Stock Guitars. Yet you still have customers who insisted on having their way. Those customers are kindly shown the door.

yes, u have the right to show them the door, its your policy and guidelines

Today, I deal with the customers of Airlines, and 200,000 of them per month at that. And you get some seriously irate passengers who have actually paid $0 for an air ticket, yet expect to be treated like SQ first class! They talk to my staff, who have to clear 2,000 passengers within 30 mins (sound impossible huh?) like they owe them a living. Or like my staff are their slaves. And when my staff don't follow SOP just once, they are terminated. And with all this pressure, my staff are still expected to smile. C'mon man... My guys/girls are human. I don't blame them for losing their patience. But what to do? People still insist that "customer is king".

well ground staff what to do bo pian, $0 passenger or $1k passenger. i guess when u mention $0 dollar meaning budget airline. Well if Dato Tony can be onboard and serve passenges with graciousness and set an example, i think he gave away a round trip airasia-x london to some makcik before *grinz*.

anyway ground staff should feedback to management and recomendation is because its budget they should be able to treat the passengers anway and anyhow they feel like it.

I always remember something: You have a right to extend your fist to where my nose is. But I also have a right not to have my nose bloodied.

it also mean do u have the means to win the fight and walk away with a bloodied nose or a cracked skull
 
Summary of thread: Personal accountability is for losers :rolleyes:

I'm out of this thread. I'll live by my own morals: I damage something that does not belong to me, I jolly well compensate the owner, be it a friend or shop, if he/she wants me to and whether or not I am held liable by the law.

good for u, dun forget to email all the guitar shops in this forum and in singapore your NRIC details and a picture so they can treat u like a super duper valuable vip customer and give u fat fat discounts.
 
anyway ground staff should feedback to management and recomendation is because its budget they should be able to treat the passengers anway and anyhow they feel like it.

I AM the management. :P I do sympathise with my staff at times (though there are some who are out-of-line themselves sometimes). But we cannot adopt a "Low Cost Low Quality" attitude, or the whole business will fail. So no choice, have to suck it up and take it like a man!

All I'm saying is that sometimes, a little mutual understanding and sensitivity on both parts goes a long way. If one side were to give, and the other were to keep on taking, something will go wrong.

it also mean do u have the means to win the fight and walk away with a bloodied nose or a cracked skull

No it doesn't mean that. It's not about means. Its about the right to defend myself regardless of whether I may win or lose. Likewise, even though the customers may be demanding and insist on being right, I have the right to decide if I am prepared to take it or not.
 
I'll live by my own morals: I damage something that does not belong to me, I jolly well compensate the owner, be it a friend or shop, if he/she wants me to and whether or not I am held liable by the law.

You know what? Up until this thread, I was of the impression that these are the same morals that everyone is supposed to learn and grow up with.

Apparently I was wrong.
 
You know what? Up until this thread, I was of the impression that these are the same morals that everyone is supposed to learn and grow up with.

Apparently I was wrong.

Only because the moral puts them on the losing end and holds them accountable for a costly mistake. If they were on the other end, they would raise hell about the other party not having any.

Guess accountability is a thing of the past and only for wimps. Real men tell those whom they erred to shove off. If this is the attitude that many adopt, I can imagine if a band breaks equipment they are allocated or rent for a gig. Or worse, someone damages the guitar I am trying to sell off in the buy/sell section while testing it. 'OH HEY IT'S DAMAGED NOW, YOU HAVE TO SELL IT TO ME AT A LOWER PRICE!'

I cannot help but draw an analogy to getting a girl pregnant by accident after a one-night-stand. Yes, gear and a life are two different things but in the end, it's all about taking responsibilty for an act you have done, regardless of the situation.
 
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.....it's all about taking responsibilty for an act you have done, regardless of the situation.
+1 to that. Sadly, this is something missing in many teens and young adults today.



sidetrack.....but for PAP, their accountability/responsibility is different from the rest. They will tell everyone theirs is an "honest mistake" and people should just "move on". :p
 
Only because the moral puts them on the losing end and holds them accountable for a costly mistake. If they were on the other end, they would raise hell about the other party not having any.

Guess accountability is a thing of the past and only for wimps. Real men tell those whom they erred to shove off. If this is the attitude that many adopt, I can imagine if a band breaks equipment they are allocated or rent for a gig. Or worse, someone damages the guitar I am trying to sell off in the buy/sell section while testing it. 'OH HEY IT'S DAMAGED NOW, YOU HAVE TO SELL IT TO ME AT A LOWER PRICE!'

I cannot help but draw an analogy to getting a girl pregnant by accident after a one-night-stand. Yes, gear and a life are two different things but in the end, it's all about taking responsibilty for an act you have done, regardless of the situation.

ah.. have u got a girl pregnant before? such wisdom! pls do share.
 
Ah, how nice of you to put words into my mouth. I was making an analogy, perhaps you are unfamiliar with that concept?

And good of you to stoop to ad hominem.
 
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Only because the moral puts them on the losing end and holds them accountable for a costly mistake. If they were on the other end, they would raise hell about the other party not having any.

Guess accountability is a thing of the past and only for wimps. Real men tell those whom they erred to shove off. If this is the attitude that many adopt, I can imagine if a band breaks equipment they are allocated or rent for a gig. Or worse, someone damages the guitar I am trying to sell off in the buy/sell section while testing it. 'OH HEY IT'S DAMAGED NOW, YOU HAVE TO SELL IT TO ME AT A LOWER PRICE!'

I cannot help but draw an analogy to getting a girl pregnant by accident after a one-night-stand. Yes, gear and a life are two different things but in the end, it's all about taking responsibilty for an act you have done, regardless of the situation.

At least I know someone out there shares my views as well on responsiblity. Brings back my previous point on wondering what we're raising today. A generation of cowards and blame shifters?

Oh well... At least I know my children will not be brought up that way for sure.

But you raise an intersting point about being on the other side of the fence. Double standard bastards... Hahaha!!!
 
Sorry to come back, but I can't help it. lol

Oh well... At least I know my children will not be brought up that way for sure.

Wait till they reach teens and hormones kick in and I bet you will be a very disappointed father. no offense, just stating the fact of life. :)

I still dont get whitestrat's and dodgethis's point... so you two are good customers... so what? I am a good customer as well. if I damaged anything I will pay for it for sure. so will everyone who posted on this thread. so what? it doesn't change the fact that no matter how many good customers out there, there will always be bad ones. there has always been bad ones since the start of time. that is why we have police and prisons. fact of the matter is, the only person that has the most power to change things (in terms of guitar store security and avoiding accidents) is the owner and sales person. no amount of teaching, preaching, breeding people about morals can protect you. Specially in singapore where there are thousands of people from all over the world enter and exit the country each day.

even your own kids, no matter how much good morals you teach them, they can easily pick up bad ones from everywhere (TV, radio, friends etc)
 
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The point of this thread is whether we should pay if a guitar is damaged...? I thought the original point was about good etiquette! Like how you should behave in a store, not running around messing things up and strangling your friends with cables. I would also like to add some sales people i have encountered are 'over helpful'. They push so many blardy products and you don't even have time to say no. I prefer to look around and then ask for help, not have someone fawning over me. personally if i want help i'll ask for it, and sometimes, people go into the stores to look around and see if a product suits them, not do 10 years of research and decide they want the products based on specs.

As for whether we should pay, i think it should be dealt in a case by case basis. The best is if the customer is willing to buy and has the financial muscle to purchase the product. If he fulfills only the former, work out an installment plan or something. If he only fulfills the latter, then, work our repair/refurbishment payments. It's the same everywhere. If you go into a gift shop and smash a glass figurine by accident, you are expected to pay! Same for guitars. Even if it's just a chip or paint scratch, i don't think the shop owners are so unreasonable to demand 50% payment, work out and pay a token sum as a form of apology.

Just my 2 cents.
 
Hi, i am agree with what you said. but as a customer do i have the right to ask for service that provided for the the music shop. A real senario that happened to me as a customer: I just brougth a guitar at 4Digits and less than a week from one of the music shop at parklane. And from the time of collection, I was in rush didn't check propely on the guitar. And i went back home play twices only. After that i found out that the guitar bridge there is some cracked on it and some part unglued. And i send it back to the shop that where i brought it. I send back just asking for guitar replacement or bridge replacement. But the shop owner was telling me that this not covered by warranty and if want to replace the bridge there will be a charges! Is this the music store concept treat customer? And telling me that the guitar was fine because still can be sounds and playable. I been play guitar for quite few years and own few guitars so far this is the first guitar that really dissapoint me with such after sales sevice. I hope you can understand as a end user customer, we are seeking for after support and we should not been treated like this type of so call "Service" . As a customer we also will blacklisted that shop and informing that the shop providing poor and terrible services. And not all the shop providing a good service for every walk in customer!
 
there are always be bad sales/guitarshop owner and bad customer. fact is. stop whining, guitarshop owner is empowered to protect his business by not fixing broken guitar and say no cover by warranty to chasing school kids that drop guitars.

they can infact protect themselves by placing guitars in lock shelves and cabinets, etc..etc.. if they leave it open for any tom dick and harry to fondle why whine when it got damage, is a calculated risk from the shopowner. set-up guidelines, policies, etc...

the best thing this thread teach me if, if i break something is i can either act blur and walk away \m/ or be a poor SOB and pay up.

thanks to the thread starter \m/
 
some salesmen at local guitar shops very one. in my experience, the shop owners are generally nice people who know how to treat customers properly. its the bad salesmen who get to me. some salesmen think they are rockstars when they are just salesmen, give you that rockstar attitude. they seem to forget that they are just salesmen working in guitar shop, and think they own the bloody shop and give you that attitude. this happens when their boss is not around. and there are even salesmen who try to smoke you, that's annoying cos you know your stuff yet you have some punk trying to smoke you with bullshit, just makes you roll your eyes.

seriously, local guitar shop salesmen need performance appraisals, and their bosses need to monitor their salesmen's customer service more tightly. if such lousy salesmen dun wanna work properly, always give black face to customers, talk crap to customers, smoke customers etc then they should not be in the sales line.

have you ever entered a local guitar shop where salesmen greet you with a smile "good afternoon sir"? or are you used to being treated like the invisible man when you walk into a guitar shop? now that i think about it, the customer service in guitar shops are generally worse than other industries. and are salesmen hired based on their guitar playing skills or customer service inclination???

something else to think about: do you feel pressure when you walk into some guitar shops? do you feel pressure when you walk into, say, any giordano outlet? why is there a difference and why should there be a difference?
 
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Talking about service, I had a nightmare experience at Guitar77 3 days ago. It's with this old guy Dennis..that's the moron's name.
I was looking for a Ds-1 japan (not silver screw ...normal ones) for a friend and saw those at the corner shop owned by Guitar77. It was locked and the price tag was kinda small. So I was asked this old guy how much is the price of those ds-1 and whether they are japan? He said they are japan and it cost $200 . Hmm, I replied to him politely " It's ok then, $200 I find the price a bit steep ". Then he asked me " Steep ah? How much do u think it cost? !"..I said around $100 plus. (I've sold one for $130 mint and at soft I've seen not-so-mint ones below $200 ) Before I could finish , he sarcastically shoot back at me " If you can get one for $100 , you sell me lah !".... Wtf!!, No point arguing. I just walked off cos I'm not the type who liked to create a scene. I was at TYMC doorstep when he shouts back again at me " Hey , if you can get one for $100, you sell me ah..!!"

I got no qualms if you wanna sell stuff above the market price or higher than other neighbouring shops but is this the way you treat your customer? I know my stuff and money is not an issue ...I've bought single pedals above $300 to $400. If he explains nicely it's a silver screw ds-1 , I would have parted my money for it ( which I doubt ). This old guy really reminded of the crap service I had in my teens years at Swee Lee Plaza S'pura. Maybe he's siblings with that George guy from Swee Lee or whatever. and I thought this kinda of crappy only exist in yesteryears!!!

Guitar77 I really hope you can up notch your service standard...it was never the same since Beez left.
 
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