Advice required - Music Recording

[vahsu]

Hi There,

Music making is my passion....I have a laptop and a midi keybaord...Iam novice in recording area....I used to just play with FL and using sound fonts on the net make interesting mp3s (I donno how far interesting to others hehe)....I surf net and try to learn about recording and stuff...Actually I often get lost with too many jargons,brands and models....But any way I managed to know abt samplers,sequencers,mixers etc...I have the following issues/decisions to make.....Hope I will get proper advice.....


My Intro

I work for an IT company and am from India....I may stay here till 1 - 2 yrs..I have yamaha PSR350.....and playing level is intermdiate.My working hrs supposedly is 8hrs but at times goes till 13 hrs.....

My AIM :

To be able to make a CD of my compositions with professional quality.

Issues I have :


1) Composing part is fine ...I will take care.My main problem is recording....
Is it possible to make one by home recording...I mean are there any limitations using s/w and gear that is affordable .

2) Is it possible to learn the recording techniques surfing the net.Or it is better joining an audio engineering school....I think if we join a school.. atleast we can work with prof gear and get tips from exp ppl...comments pls

3) If so which one to join....is SAE good one.? I enquired abt diploma
course they offer,which was good but looking expensive....what say?

4) Or doing online course is better...berkeley was offering such course...

5) All the home recordists standing there did any such course...or just learnt doing r&d ??

6) There is one more option....Is there anyone who has rght gear and is sort of expert ...who can invite me to your studio when you are doing some recording .... so that I come to know how u guys do it...If required (hope u dont ask hehe) Iam ready to pay...If interested you can mail vzbijumalla@kanbay.com or call 67546192 or 68786826.


Thanks,

 

[lowjk]

>> I may stay here till 1 - 2 yrs..I have yamaha PSR350.....and playing level is intermdiate.My working hrs supposedly is 8hrs but at times goes till 13 hrs.....

If that's the case, forget hardware synth. Sitck with softsynths. Pack a few CDs and you're done. When you move back to India or get posted elsewhere, you'll really thank me.

FL is a very good program for the price. Make sure you've upgraded to FL5.

If you're on a laptop, you may wish to get a better audio interface if you are recording from your keyboard.

If not, then win asio4all is a must to use VST instruments.
http://michael.tippach.bei.t-online.de/asio4all/


>> To be able to make a CD of my compositions with professional quality.

With your long working hours, I suggest that you stick with composing and arranging.

Once you have a rough mix, pay a little to a mastering house to do the final tweaking on your music.

There's no need to go to an audio school unless
1) you plan to enter the audio biz
2) you have too much free time and wish to learn more.

Here's a list of sites you could surf to (there's a list on this thread):
http://forum.trancerepublic.com/viewtopic.php?t=765

good luck,
jk

 

[ovid]

'tis true. all you need in 2005 to make this happen is a good 'powderful' laptops (you only need one; local lingual confusion of singular/plural ; sorry practising local patois after several years}

software synths, samplers, emulators are all you need to make musical amusement.

 

[veganbleu]

Hi there and welcome to singapore!

What kind of music are you thinking of putting out? Are you thinking of actually recording instruments? Because from your gear list, i gather it's more about mastering/mixing of your tracks that you're concerned with.

Like lowjk says, unless you're going into the business or have a lot of time, the audio schools are out.

It would be easier to split up the focus into either recording external sounds i.e. drums, vocals, field recordings, or mixing/mastering. If you;re using software effects, this is a nice set of vst plugins that you can use:
http://www.kjaerhusaudio.com/classic-series.php

They take up relatively low cpu usage.

If you're not sure what's it all about, then some research on google will be the most help.

 

[vahsu]

Thanks a lot for the replies.....

1) Gave up thought of audio engineering.But I have serious plans of entering music biz...I want to be a film composer (ofcourse indian movies)...at altron weekly twice (for 6 months) they are offering dip in music prod...for 4.6k...but it seems this is not complete ine...they even have 2 more adv dip courses(3 months each)...whole of which (the three)is upto 10k+.So gave up that as of now...But I understand importance of sound quality in film songs and will try to learn from net.


2) I have no problem in buying hw gear....the more i want is feel and quality...It will be difficult when I go back...but thats fine...ofcourse i wuld prefer sw as long as it is cheaper and no latency/high cpu usage (I really hate this latency...it kills all the fun).....may be latency is due to my soundcard

3) Regarding latency...I created one beat using FL...exported it to mp3..and was playimg in winamp...then when i try to play using my keybaord....atleast a latency of 1 sec comes...i haave to mute sound in cakewalk (btw i use this for recording)......then it will be fine....but timing will go...will change in soundcard solve this problem?...i tried to change buffer rate even then no use.btw my laptop has 20 gb hard disk,1.2 ghz ,1.0gb ram

4) I prefer to record only thru keyboard by MIDI....I read in some other threads abt line-in....I hope it means...directly routing audio of the keyboard to the soundcard...dint try...donno much abt it...but will try.Then will appply virtual instruments.

5) Did some tweaking in tweakheadz.com and made the following list to buy...pls gimme ur comments...btw i use only 1 instrument as of now...and vocals.....I donno for this mixers are required or not...if anyone owns one of the below...pls let me know ur comments :

Sonar 3 Studio
Tascam FW1884 DAW/Audio/MIDI Interface (does this incl a soundcard?)
T-Racks Mastering Plugin
Sound Forge 7   and CD Architect
Behringer B2031A Truth Active Monitors
Studio Projects C1


On the site it was said that the above can give me prof qulaity...is it true?...over all how much can it cost in sing currency?...and is it worth for the money...


Thanks,
Vasu

 

[vahsu]

May be I missed out...I use midiman 1x1 for midi thru USB...is this the culprit for latency?

 

[veganbleu]

Most of the problem lies with the soundcard that you're using at the moment. If you get the tascam, which i don't know if you can over here in singapore, it should solve the problems you have. The current version of sonar is 4. T-Racks is a brilliant mastering plugin, mostly due to it's saturation algorithm. You might want to check out waves L3 as well. I'm not too keen on the behringer monitors but some people like them. Haven't actually heard a studio projects C1, but behringer's got a couple of really cheap versions for under 200 under a 100 even last time i checked for a condenser mike. If you get sonar, you don't need soundforge, and usually a CD burner will come with a bundled burning program just like CD architect, though not strictly redbook. But if you're doing film scores no one will bother about whether the CDs are redbook compliant, just a data cd will be fine. Don't really know how ethnic you want to get, but if you do you'll need some romplers like the ethnosphere or knaglis, unless you're going to physically record sitars, veena's etc.

 

[lowjk]

2) I have no problem in buying hw gear....the more i want is feel and quality...It will be difficult when I go back...but thats fine...ofcourse i wuld prefer sw as long as it is cheaper and no latency/high cpu usage (I really hate this latency...it kills all the fun).....may be latency is due to my soundcard

Use the win asio4all Vahsu. If works, it will drop the latency to a useable level.

If it doesn't, then you'll need a audio interface.

 

[vahsu]

lowjk : Thanks...will try asio4all...

veganbleu :

1) Will try to find if Tascam is available here...and also the cost...wonder what could be the cost now..In some thread I read it as S$ 3230...hope it is cheaper now .....In case it is not available in singapore...how to get...(order from the U.S?)
2) Thanks for telling abt Romplers....will give a search in the net....and try them out..Actually I thought of asking abt Indian instruments before but forgot...thanks for that.....Which one is better ?...getting such rompler or using s/w sampler (again which one is better giga studio,sample tank or contakt or anything else?)....btw as said b4 I prefer only recording thru my midi kb as of now...

 

[joel68]

Hi...There are lot's of options available..ultimately everything depends on how much you spend..I have never gone to any audio schools..But, have mixed 3 albums and recorded tracks for 3 telemovies and serials...for big channels..

You have to read a lot, buy good magazines...

SAE, Altron...all still teach you the older way..but the technology is improving day by day where the schools have not... :roll: [Any SAE,Altorn students here, pls excuse me]


Check your email..I have sent you my contacts...I hope that I can help you..

 

[lowjk]

lowjk : Thanks...will try asio4all...

2) Thanks for telling abt Romplers....will give a search in the net....and try them out..Actually I thought of asking abt Indian instruments before but forgot...thanks for that.....Which one is better ?...getting such rompler or using s/w sampler (again which one is better giga studio,sample tank or contakt or anything else?)....btw as said b4 I prefer only recording thru my midi kb as of now...

ROMplers are also avaible in the VSTi format.

Example:
General Rompler
Luxonix Ravity


Specialised Rompler
SwarPlug for Indian Percussion Instruments
Spectrasonics Trilogy for bass
Spectrasonics Atmosphere for pads

Lots of info on VST on this site:
http://www.kvraudio.com/

(you can search for those listed above here)

 

[sound_designer]

dear my lowjk... i am impressed dat u telling ppl, unless they gtg into music buisness, they dun have to go to audio sch...!! u're nuts dude...!!!
in the first place when one have to work with sound... knows the fundamental n characteristic of sound first ...!!
second.. how can u work with processors when u dun noe shit abt their parameters..?
let alone the signal flow...!!
dude... dun lead the guy the wrong way mannn...!!!
anyone... need any advice, juz mail me..!!
cheers

 

[Cheez]

dear my lowjk... i am impressed dat u telling ppl, unless they gtg into music buisness, they dun have to go to audio sch...!! u're nuts dude...!!!
in the first place when one have to work with sound... knows the fundamental n characteristic of sound first ...!!
second.. how can u work with processors when u dun noe shit abt their parameters..?
let alone the signal flow...!!
dude... dun lead the guy the wrong way mannn...!!!
anyone... need any advice, juz mail me..!!
cheers

Knowing something does not mean that you have to go to school to learn it. You can still pick up a lot from reading from other sources. Of course one may learn more in an audio school, but for all intended purposes of making music at home (vahsu seemed to indicate that he is going to do home recording - am I right, vahsu?), it may not be necessary. That does not mean it will not be beneficial - knowing more is always better. If one has the money and time, why not.

 

[lowjk]

dear my lowjk... i am impressed dat u telling ppl, unless they gtg into music buisness, they dun have to go to audio sch...!! u're nuts dude...!!!
in the first place when one have to work with sound... knows the fundamental n characteristic of sound first ...!!
second.. how can u work with processors when u dun noe shit abt their parameters..?
let alone the signal flow...!!
dude... dun lead the guy the wrong way mannn...!!!
anyone... need any advice, juz mail me..!!
cheers

I'm not saying an eduction is bad but you have to see it from Vashu's prespective: Vahsu has a full time job, working 8 to 12 hours a day.
If he enrols in a music engineering school, and finish the course in 1 to 2 years, do you think he still has time for his first love which is composing?

No one needs to learn the intricaties of a professional recording to do basic home recording.
If that were true, then you'll need to go to medical school to buy panadol at 7-11.

If it's something over your head, you can always pay an audio engineer to help out, just like how people pay to see a doctor if the panadol isn't working.

 

[sound_designer]

yeah datz true... y dun ppl like vashu juz stick to his fulltime job n juz buy cd fom music shops... dat would save all the money n pain trying to figure out wat r the knobs n faders for...
n yeah... for a knob of parameters u need to pay an engineer to figure it out... so how much more do u really need to do dat bro, i cun imagine hw much would he have to invest to finished up juz a song... itz more than juz like buying a panadol from a 7-11.. hehehe

ur sence of theory is way too off...!!
oh well... do wat u think is good for u dudes....

 

[soft]

dear my lowjk... i am impressed dat u telling ppl, unless they gtg into music buisness, they dun have to go to audio sch...!! u're nuts dude...!!!

please dont go around calling people names. lowjk has been a SOFT member for a long time and he has spend much of his time helping other users in the field of computer music. respect is the word.

 

[radha]

composing and home studio

Dear Vahsu,
Composing and recording are entirely different subjects.I am a person who spend more than 12 years playing keyboard.I used to play Indian music and used perform a lot in stage programs.A lot ads ,tv serials so far.Indian film industry is very intersesting.I have seen many music directors who don’t know even the basics of music.Only thing they have is a melody of a song.They seek the help of a person who is versatile in arranging music according to the melody.If you go thru the Indian film music I don’t think you can see any music directors who is well aware of the secrets of good recording.
Recording is a field where you need time, patience ,dedication and technology.Missing one of these can affect the quality of a song.If you are going behind expensive and quality products,without the proper knowledge of how to use these, you wont get a good result.
Music directors like AR Rahman making big hits because he is able to combine melody and technology in the right way.So don’t think that the technology will give rise to a hit song. First of all the melody is important.Then use technology to hide or boost the parts music. More than 80% of peoples hear the music in ordinary speakers and they never enquire whether you have recorded using protools or cakewalk.I mean after all music should be soothening.
When I used go for recording , I had to take care of the musical parts I sequenced in my keyboard ,and a set of good phono and midi cables.Rest of of the headache goes to the recordist.After recording I had to spend time with the recordist to get a good output.Spending time with a understanding,knowledgeabe, friendly recordist will give you more result than your huge investment in a home studio.
When you buy a mixer, sound card,computer ,proff: mic, high quality speakers and start your own studio your headache will increase.When you connect all the home studio equipment in right way and when you start recording you will gradually understand that something is missing in your songs.Some times it doesn’t sound even like a normal song recorded with a simple tape recorder.So when you more concentrate in improving the quality of recording naturally you are away from your composing and arranging which is your passion.
I bought a mixer ,a sound card ,a computer to improve my recording. Each time when I get a bad result I have to start exploring from cabling to repeated installing of software and ended up with asking silly questions to different forums.So when you compose music you have only one headache that is to make sure that the music is pleasant.Rest leave to the recordist.
I liked the brilliant advice from Mr lowjk that “With your long working hours, I suggest that you stick with composing and arranging.Once you have a rough mix, pay a little to a mastering house to do the final tweaking on your music.”A wise person can only give you an advice like this.
So first of all make sure what you wanted to be? A music director or a owner of a good recording studio?.And when you concentrate in composing music, try to acquire more knowledge in the area of recording by reading and discussing with other knowledgeable peoples.
Regards
rk

 

[vahsu]

Thanks a lot Radha.....You are right ....I should stick to music alone and leave the recording part to a recordist......currently Iam working on improving my keyboard and musical skills (I came to know recently that I need to improve these a lot).....then will head towards composing and recording....

Thanks a lot guys for your valuable info.....