The 7 different modes : Ionian, dorian.. etc
- Thread starter edmund_7
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Modes
Ok Edmund,
This one is difficult to explain. Basically, the main scale is the Ionian (Major Scale). The rest are devrived from this scale.
As for which scale to use, errrr I'm an ear player (i.e. I don't read notes etc and just kinda improvise using scales). So basically, through experience I learn where to press lar.
Ok Edmund,
This one is difficult to explain. Basically, the main scale is the Ionian (Major Scale). The rest are devrived from this scale.
As for which scale to use, errrr I'm an ear player (i.e. I don't read notes etc and just kinda improvise using scales). So basically, through experience I learn where to press lar.
Basically
Ok,
This one I really don't know how to explain. I just kinda improvise everything I play from the Major Scale with some variations here and there.
(I also read that everything is devrived from the Ionian (Major Scale). So that's why I just improvise from there.
I don't really know the exact theory.
Anyone wish to help me out here?
Ok,
This one I really don't know how to explain. I just kinda improvise everything I play from the Major Scale with some variations here and there.
(I also read that everything is devrived from the Ionian (Major Scale). So that's why I just improvise from there.
I don't really know the exact theory.
Anyone wish to help me out here?
ok u say u improvise rite?
i have a major scale in my head, but i still cant understand how playing around wif those notes within the scale can create some nice tunes.. any patterns?
i see my friends solo like crazy spider fingers flash-like speed, about 1/4 of steve vai or maybe 1/2 of his skills (haha), and they say they play from scales.. dun understand.. anyone pros?
i have a major scale in my head, but i still cant understand how playing around wif those notes within the scale can create some nice tunes.. any patterns?
i see my friends solo like crazy spider fingers flash-like speed, about 1/4 of steve vai or maybe 1/2 of his skills (haha), and they say they play from scales.. dun understand.. anyone pros?
edmund_7 said:
If you want to start fiddling around with scales that can go with most rock or metal music, try learning the basic pentatonic scale. There are basically 5 positions that you can play the scale across the fretboard. Learn it in one key, say in G, first. The fingering is the same for all other keys. You just start at different positions that's all.
Most guitar websites that have lessons will have the pentatonic scale laid out for you. More importantly, start learning the notes of the fretboard as this will help greatly when learning to play scales.
Or just get a guitar book on scales and learn from there,. That's what I did first, before turning to the internet.
cold_static544
New member
It would be good if you have a keyboard on hand so that it'll be easier to explain.
The Ionian mode is basically a major scale and C ionian goes with the notes CDEFGABC. What defines a scale, and the distinctive sound is its intervallic pattern, as for the major scale it would be wwwhwwwh.
And if you look at the D dorian mode, it is actually DEFGABCD with D as the root note. But if you look carefully while it contains the same notes as the C major scale, it has a totally different intervallic pattern because it is starting now, on a D.
So on and so forth for E phrygian F lydian G mixo, A aeolian (which is the same as a natural minor scale) and B locrian, all these contain the notes of the C major scale but each possess its unique intervallic pattern and thus its own sound.
Ionian, aeolian is quite universal, can be used for basically anything. You'll find lydian and dorian more in jazz. Mixolydian in standard rock. Phrygian in neo-classical and locrian in metal. These are of course gross generalizations and it differ from song to song.
The Ionian mode is basically a major scale and C ionian goes with the notes CDEFGABC. What defines a scale, and the distinctive sound is its intervallic pattern, as for the major scale it would be wwwhwwwh.
And if you look at the D dorian mode, it is actually DEFGABCD with D as the root note. But if you look carefully while it contains the same notes as the C major scale, it has a totally different intervallic pattern because it is starting now, on a D.
So on and so forth for E phrygian F lydian G mixo, A aeolian (which is the same as a natural minor scale) and B locrian, all these contain the notes of the C major scale but each possess its unique intervallic pattern and thus its own sound.
Ionian, aeolian is quite universal, can be used for basically anything. You'll find lydian and dorian more in jazz. Mixolydian in standard rock. Phrygian in neo-classical and locrian in metal. These are of course gross generalizations and it differ from song to song.
Elvin-Seraphim
New member
scales
well..this sounds pretty chim..lol..and the significance of these scales are?
well..this sounds pretty chim..lol..and the significance of these scales are?
vernplum
New member
The best way to understand the modes is to hear them side by side, starting from the same root.
Normally, when an explanation of the modes is given it goes something like this (I start by showing you this, which is the *wrong* way to explain modes)
C Ionian is C D E F G A B C
D Dorian is D E F G A B C D
E Phygian is E F G A B C D E
....and then the student plays a C Ionian, starting on C and ascending and descending the scale, and then the teacher (or website, or whatever) says "ok - now to the Dorian mode!" and the student then plays D Dorian, starting on D and ascending, descending, etc... all the examples are in the same key - C Major, just starting on different notes, so naturally, the beginning player scratches his or her head and goes "huh? it's just starting on different notes on the scale" and they don't *hear* the benefit of the modes.
The BEST WAY TO UNDERSTAND THE MODES, as I stated earlier, is to play them all starting from the same root - in other words, all starting on C, for example (consult any good website near you for fingerings)
C Ionian C D E F G A B
C Dorian C D Eb F G A Bb
C Phrygian C Db Eb F G Ab Bb
C Lydian C D E F# G A B
C Mixolydian C D E F G A Bb
C Aeolian C D Eb F G Ab Bb
C Locrian C Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb
By doing this, you will be able to hear the difference in the sound of the modes much more clearly.
In terms of which modes to play over which chords, I'm not super expert on this, but generally, you match the interval between the 1st and 3rd of each scale with the Major/Minorness of the underlying chord.
Example - chord is C major, I can play C Ionian, C Lydian, or C Mixolydian over it because the interval between the 1st and 3rd of each of these scales is a MAJOR 3rd.
Example - chord is C Minor, I can play C Aeolian, C Dorian, C Phrygian or C Locrian over it, because the interval between the 1st and 3rd of each of these scales is a MINOR 3rd.
Example - chorsd is C Diminshed - I can play C Locrian over it because it contains the MINOR 3rd and a DIMINISHED 7th interval from 1st to 3rd and 1st to 7th respectively.
Normally, when an explanation of the modes is given it goes something like this (I start by showing you this, which is the *wrong* way to explain modes)
C Ionian is C D E F G A B C
D Dorian is D E F G A B C D
E Phygian is E F G A B C D E
....and then the student plays a C Ionian, starting on C and ascending and descending the scale, and then the teacher (or website, or whatever) says "ok - now to the Dorian mode!" and the student then plays D Dorian, starting on D and ascending, descending, etc... all the examples are in the same key - C Major, just starting on different notes, so naturally, the beginning player scratches his or her head and goes "huh? it's just starting on different notes on the scale" and they don't *hear* the benefit of the modes.
The BEST WAY TO UNDERSTAND THE MODES, as I stated earlier, is to play them all starting from the same root - in other words, all starting on C, for example (consult any good website near you for fingerings)
C Ionian C D E F G A B
C Dorian C D Eb F G A Bb
C Phrygian C Db Eb F G Ab Bb
C Lydian C D E F# G A B
C Mixolydian C D E F G A Bb
C Aeolian C D Eb F G Ab Bb
C Locrian C Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb
By doing this, you will be able to hear the difference in the sound of the modes much more clearly.
In terms of which modes to play over which chords, I'm not super expert on this, but generally, you match the interval between the 1st and 3rd of each scale with the Major/Minorness of the underlying chord.
Example - chord is C major, I can play C Ionian, C Lydian, or C Mixolydian over it because the interval between the 1st and 3rd of each of these scales is a MAJOR 3rd.
Example - chord is C Minor, I can play C Aeolian, C Dorian, C Phrygian or C Locrian over it, because the interval between the 1st and 3rd of each of these scales is a MINOR 3rd.
Example - chorsd is C Diminshed - I can play C Locrian over it because it contains the MINOR 3rd and a DIMINISHED 7th interval from 1st to 3rd and 1st to 7th respectively.
Elvin-Seraphim
New member
fabulous
hehe..wow..dat's alot to digest.hmm..well..i do know my scales kinda well enuff fer me to play it off-hand..but i didn't realli see the link to each scale..lol..tho i know how it sounds like by ear..tahnx fer the insight..
hehe..wow..dat's alot to digest.hmm..well..i do know my scales kinda well enuff fer me to play it off-hand..but i didn't realli see the link to each scale..lol..tho i know how it sounds like by ear..tahnx fer the insight..
guitar_phreak
New member
Good explaination Vernplum!
marshall_law
New member
For using what modes with what chords, it actually up to yourself. Each modes have different modal sounds. The most common uses modes are lydian, phygrain and mixolydian.
For me when i use modes, i accompany them by using sus2 or sus4 chords. As there chords do not have their 3rd in them, their key is not determine and i can use any modes over them. So if i have a Gsus2, i can use a G mixolydian or a G lydian. I just play to the chords and see which sounds i prefer.
To know how these modes sound like, just listen to their intervals. Vernplum has explained something about intervals.
You can't play the modes base on their interval. For C major you can play any modes in a C major scale but you can't play C lydian and C mixolydian as it's not in the key of C major. The 3rd determines the key of the scales. It'll clash if you play C lydian or mixolydian over it.
For me when i use modes, i accompany them by using sus2 or sus4 chords. As there chords do not have their 3rd in them, their key is not determine and i can use any modes over them. So if i have a Gsus2, i can use a G mixolydian or a G lydian. I just play to the chords and see which sounds i prefer.
To know how these modes sound like, just listen to their intervals. Vernplum has explained something about intervals.
You can't play the modes base on their interval. For C major you can play any modes in a C major scale but you can't play C lydian and C mixolydian as it's not in the key of C major. The 3rd determines the key of the scales. It'll clash if you play C lydian or mixolydian over it.
creatures77
New member
disagree...i tink that person refers to C major as one without extensions..no 7th 9ths 11 13s..
thus the C major chord consists of 1 3 5 only..it can refer to the 4th chord in a G major key..or 5th chord in a F major key
the Lydian and mixolydian scales both has a major 3rd and 5th..
if the song permits..theses 3 scales: major, mixo and lydian is possible..though there are probably lots more scales u can use
thus the C major chord consists of 1 3 5 only..it can refer to the 4th chord in a G major key..or 5th chord in a F major key
the Lydian and mixolydian scales both has a major 3rd and 5th..
if the song permits..theses 3 scales: major, mixo and lydian is possible..though there are probably lots more scales u can use
marshall_law
New member
Hmm... got to verify that with my teacher. The notes in a C ionian, lydian and mixolydian is different. Got to ask again.