question about gain on clean channels

niteblade

niteblade

New member
as you know. some amps have a "gain/level" knob on their clean channel and a "master volume" knob

332295.jpg


i would like to ask if the same volume level were achieved through different settings

eg gain 4 volume 10
or gain 10 volume 4

would it make a difference? in maybe headroom,saturation and etc.

i dont usually get a chance to experiment slowly with the big amps so yeah ><

hope my question makes sense

cheers
 
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Very good question! Its been something I've wanted to know as well,but for me I usually lower the gain instead of a higher gain, lower volume option cause with the added gain, although it sounds good for my cleans it adds more feedback when my dirt pedals kick in (in need of better gain control perhaps)..
 
The gain pot is usually placed after the first preamp tube, is a volume if there is no master volume,which is placed at the end of the preamp tube before the splitter into power tubes.

Vintage amps came with only volume (after the first preamp stage) and has to be played really loud to get preamp breakup. Later these amps were mod with a Master volume (after preamp stages) giving possibilities to harness preamp breakup at lower volume.

Most SS amps do the same too.

guitar --> preamp --> volume (gain) --> second preamp --> master volume --> splitter(push pull amps only) -->power --)OT --> speaker.
 
break up = more saturation??

heh not really familiar with the termilogy

would the cleans make any difference on my eventual dirt tone? eg with the two settings i gave
 
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niteblade said:
break up = more saturation??

heh not really familiar with the termilogy
Click to expand...

saturation ??

Now when you have breakup = the amp looses its capability to deliver anything that is now fed into it ... so keep as clean as possible if you are using dirt pedals.
 
...just to add ...thats why those vox amps dont take dirt pedals well as they break up early !! But they rock with just booster thrown in front !!
 
can i ask something?

when i want to crank the tubes to get it to break up for overdrive, which volume to i crank? the master or the volume knob for the channel.

and also, can u get overdrive simply cranking the volume on the clean channel to break up?

whats the difference between that and a drive channel?
 
gsonique said:
The gain pot is usually placed after the first preamp tube, is a volume if there is no master volume,which is placed at the end of the preamp tube before the splitter into power tubes.

Vintage amps came with only volume (after the first preamp stage) and has to be played really loud to get preamp breakup. Later these amps were mod with a Master volume (after preamp stages) giving possibilities to harness preamp breakup at lower volume.
Click to expand...

Trust Goose to give this kind of answer... Took me 15 mins to understand what you're saying. And I studied Electronics!!!:twisted:

Breakup basically means signal clipping (I think). The signal cannot be pure anymore. The difference between the 2 channels is the number of clipping stages for each one. (I think).

thats why those vox amps dont take dirt pedals well as they break up early !! But they rock with just booster thrown in front !! thats why those vox amps dont take dirt pedals well as they break up early !! But they rock with just booster thrown in front !!
Click to expand...

I got a 65' Princeton Reverb Reissue arriving next week. It apparently breaks up very early, and easily. I'm dying to see what happens when I simply pump a basic mild OD pedal into it! 2x 6v6, 2x 12AX7 and a tube rectifier!!! heheheh...
 
lifele55 said:
So with dirt pedals, its best to set the amp as clean as possible...noted..
Click to expand...

Again, depends on what you like. I personally like a little bit of natural breakup when I hit the strings very hard, and a booster to push the tubes into distortion. That's ahy a 2 channel amp and a crunch pedal works best for me. 3 gain stages... Me likey!!!!
 
dudelove said:
can i ask something?

when i want to crank the tubes to get it to break up for overdrive, which volume to i crank? the master or the volume knob for the channel.

and also, can u get overdrive simply cranking the volume on the clean channel to break up?

whats the difference between that and a drive channel?
Click to expand...

First let me clear my throat.....

Preamp distortion....

Yes, take your small radio and max the volume knob....you will get it all distorted .... Same goes to a guitar amp, tube or SS (Solid State).

Now, the only problem here is, it will be loud and nasty.

Saying that, if you want preamp distortion ...crank the volume (aka gain) and use master volume to set level (volume).

To get power amp break up...first get ear plugs...then max the master and slowly bring up the gain or volume.

If your amp has just one volume ...you only got one option to play it LOUD unless you want to mod or get an attenuator between your amp and speaker.

In a drive channel more preamp stages are added and distortion gets added a little from one stage into the other and this gives a much smoother distortion and can be voiced accordingly to taste.

In other words... we got better managing dirt...
... in a high gain amp.
 
I like my cleans to have some bite to them as well thats why now I'm experimenting with the Bad Monkey on all the time with low gain to have some drive as my 'cleans'..
 
huh? okay? so it's cleaner clean tone + distortion pedals? = more saturated distorted tone? or dirtier clean tone + distortion pedals = more saturated distorted tone?
Hahaha. I need to read up about electronics in guitar amps.
 
Doesn't it depend on the pedals used, the amps used and the end effect one would like to achieve?

Like a dead clean channel might be the preferred setup for many high gain pedals... but some people just find their tone having the amp breaking up a little and throwing in a high gain pedal.

Some pedals just need that clean headroom or it just chokes up. Sputters. Over-gained-up-compressed-crappy-squealing-sludge... which can STILL be useful...

Then there are some pedals that... if you run into an amp with a ton of headroom - the thing sounds stupid. Like a range master... into an amp with high headroom... just increases the volume and chops off low end, accentuates high end = thin out your tone. But into an amp that breaks up easily... like woah baby!
 
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