MM Lee says, welcome foreign immigrants with open arms

[jullian_bei]

it's a market thingy. if more singaporean willing to do 3D works (difficult, dirty, danger) with low paying then foreigner will less needed. also if singaporean can tahan having more than 2 babies then the population here can tahan also.

singaporean also cheap labour in more advance country like US and Europe. singapore should be proud to become a destination for more low developt country job seeeker for a new life.

 

[mrmisse]

Well, since you put it that way, I will rephrase the apology as directed to everyone else but you.

FARK YOU!!!

*blows raspberry and points two middle fingers*

..|..

Wah.. so aggro siah.. i was just stating an analogy that's so evident on the internet and am not trying to diss you. Getting so worked up over such trivial matters will only make your blood boil unnecessarily and it's not healthy for your heart.

 

[AgingYouth]

i'm ok with foreign students, but gotta make sure they get the hot lookin ones pls. and make sure they're broke, so they can moonlight as bartop dancers.

Gotch what.

Go to most Tanjong Pagar/ Duxton Road pubs and there are a lotta PRC waitresses in hotpants and shorts. They will tell you that they are studying in MDIS or Kaplan or some private universities.

And some of them are hawt. Burning (not smokin') hawt.

 

[mrmisse]

What's the point in apologizing? lol? Ever heard of something called manners?

Manners is when you think before you act and consider the implications that will occur to people if you do something wrong. What i'm trying to say is that the advancement in technology has transformed the mindsets of the new generation, making them extremely impatient and spoilt. What wrong is there by welcoming immigrants? All the developed countries have the same scenario.

 

[AgingYouth]

What wrong is there by welcoming immigrants? All the developed countries have the same scenario.

I'll take 'em blonde or brunette with porcelain skin.

 

[ymmak]

Foreigners are happy with lower pays because they have lesser liabilities in this country. They may not contribute to cpf, are not taxed as much, have few relatives or even no family here, no children to support, no elderly to look after. On the other hand, Singaporeans have to support our families here. We need to take care of our parents, our children's education, our lodging, housing loans blablabla. And income tax. Btw, have you file for your income tax already? Deadline is coming.

The foreigners probably have other things to worry about. But financially, they surely have lesser liabilities. No wonder they are easily contented with lesser pay.

 

[AgingYouth]

Sorry dude, that's the biggest assumption I've read the whole day. It's like back in the Middle Ages where people thought that Earth was flat and sat on the back of a giant turtle.

Foreign workers, be it skilled or non-skilled, have a choice to pay CPF or not. My friend didn't. He believes that hard-cold cash supports his drinking better. He helps out his mum back home in Maritius financially time to time.

Have you talked to a Filipino maid recently? My aunt's domestic helper has 3 kids back home to support and a house to help out with the mortgage.

By the way, the deadline for income tax filing is not coming. It's today.

 

[Mobius]

i rememebered seeingthe pingpong team doing a victory parade in the city area, an uncle hurled some vulgarities at them, saying what is there to be proud of

 

[empihsrow]

What i'm trying to say is that the advancement in technology has transformed the mindsets of the new generation, making them extremely impatient and spoilt.

Dude, generalization there.

Immigrants are forever a problem or a benefit. It depends on how you see it.

The increasingly amount of immigrants is just the product of globalization. If you don't like it, go build an island and make it Communist. That will probably satisfy your wishes.

 

[mrmisse]

Dude, generalization there.

Immigrants are forever a problem or a benefit. It depends on how you see it.

The increasingly amount of immigrants is just the product of globalization. If you don't like it, go build an island and make it Communist. That will probably satisfy your wishes.

That comment was for 'think before you speak' and nothing to do with globalisation. You're not reading my entire post. How can i say that i welcome immigrants and then wanna go and set up a communist island? I love the sight of these foreign girls.. now, that's a good reason to get your blood boiling.

 

[jarload]

my wife is unemployed now... n guess what the bank that she used to work for kept hiring foreigners....REASON: she contribute to cpf and they don't but salary is still the same...eventually they will get their PR and have to contribute to cpf too... so its ok to see s'pore dying here of unemplyment and kept advertising job opportunities in jobsdb but hiring foreigners...

well those recruitment consultant should not just include proficient in chinese they might as well indicate clearly in bold WE ARE HIRING ONLY FOREIGNERS!!!!

not only that has anyone came across calling any call centre and trying to make you're enquiry and at the background you could hear its almost like you're calling Manilla or some Makati club... and before the call ended u cld hear comments like TANG INA!!! can someone translate please....

 

[Union]

umm duh...

Would any of u guys be willing to work as cleaners, construction workers, janitors, maids, rubbish collectors etc? How many of u guys are willing to work odd hours + graveyard shift etc?.. Lots of these jobs though unglam, are really necessary.

...

I agree with u on this issue , bro. That's the reason we got to strike a balance between having foreigners or not.

On another note, I have a friend studying in NUS having problem understanding their professors/lecturers because of this foreign accent barrier. Some of these Indian/Chinese national are also coming to our shores as professors etc. My friend is in engineering , that makes life tougher. I believed they don't have problem with english proficiency but are we really lacking of local high calibre professor/lecturers?

The problem of foreign workers does'nt exist on the low skill ones but it's almost every income level. Middle income, professionals , executives etc. Have u read the recent articles in Straits Times on Sentosa IR offering jobs to foreigners...certain high skills/new jobs where Singapore don't have the experience, are ok to be given away. But how abt cleaning, customer relations, technicians etc. Those are generic jobs
But again back to the same question..do singaporeans wanna do these unglam jobs? Can they fill the quota... to which I believe they can with the current economic woes.

 

[extremers]

it's weird that once the term "immigrants" is mentioned, general singaporeans shallowly tend to think that they're here for the difficult, dangerous and dirty jobs. bro Union and Jarload made a point. i foresee this trend nowdays and it's quite scary.

 

[wyldeboon]

reminds me of a song by sting...


"oooh oh i'm an alien... i'm a legal alien... i'm a ____________ (insert country of origin) man in singapura"

 

[ymmak]

Sorry dude, that's the biggest assumption I've read the whole day. It's like back in the Middle Ages where people thought that Earth was flat and sat on the back of a giant turtle.

Foreign workers, be it skilled or non-skilled, have a choice to pay CPF or not. My friend didn't. He believes that hard-cold cash supports his drinking better. He helps out his mum back home in Maritius financially time to time.

Have you talked to a Filipino maid recently? My aunt's domestic helper has 3 kids back home to support and a house to help out with the mortgage.

By the way, the deadline for income tax filing is not coming. It's today.

Pls read carefully the words I have used. I seldom go wrong with words. I used 'may not contribute to cpf', I didnt say they never contribute to cpf.

And I said "less liabilities in this country", "this country" refers to Singapore, not Philiphines. BTW, they are earning S$ to support their family at home, while Singaporeans earn the same S$ to support our families in Singapore, where the cost of living is higher. I always hedge my opinions before I post, lest I encounter rebuttals from others like yourself.

But there is one thing I am unsure about is whether employers contribute to the foreigners' cpf or not.

 

[tim098]

This thread is awesome, love how so many mini arguments between different people suddenly transpired.

I think we partly have ourselves to blame. Ask any young married couple out there whether they are going to have kids. The most likely reply would be either 2 maximum, or none at all. The trend of having absolutely no children is becoming more common. I don't know why and I cannot comprehend that logic but that's just me.

The Govt. knows this full well, they've been bitching about the whole ageing population and our inability to (what's the word? I'll just use) replenish our population. So they see bringing in foreigners as a solution, or one part of a big solution because I am pretty sure foreigners alone won't help that much.

On the other hand, I am upset with for one, those who can't speak english. If you are an educated Singaporean, I'd expect you to be at least grammatically correct. If you are a foreigner, I would expect you to be able to PRONOUNCE certain BASIC words properly. Apparantly even that is too much to ask.

And taking up our University places, although I really dread this, it isn't a particularly bad thing. That's just how life works. Since they are, in the eyes of the university, more 'valuable and qualified', they take the places in our stead. Happens in all kinds of places and organisations and I must say it isn't unfair, unless a university sets out to be a Singaporean-Only university.

And please don't get me started on the sports thing. You know recently they've been advertising all these China pingpong players who are 'Singaporean'. Fking ridiculous.

 

[Tetragrammaton]

Honestly, I agree almost everything that the MM said. But being a Singaporean I also sympathised those who lost their jobs and having a hard time in life. I have also to agree that many Singaporeans who are holding jobs don't deserve that so called earning ability. Like for instance, we can still see those Singaporean especially at a counter...you as a guest come over and asked her or him something...you have a rude reply like, "What do you want ha?" I have countless experience on this even till today.

I am an a Technical person in profession. I meet supposedly technically qualified personnel almost everyday. But many that I've met knows nothing technically. Can easily be cheated by the contractors. I'm saying this through my personal experience. So I wonder which Universities these guys graduated from? Hmm....they must be a graduate since they are either Engineers or Maintenance Managers.

Well a former colleague of mine, a graduate in electrical engineering with an Honorary lost his job 5 years ago as an engineer. I know him personally as someone who knows his job well. But after waiting for 3 years without a job, guess what he's doing? He's a cleaner at the HDB estate drawing $800 per month. Whose to blame? I actually respected his decision to lower down his wings. On his own words,"If I don't do this, I got nothing to spend. But luckily my wife still holds a proper job." Anyway, the job was also given by CDC. They never even see his degree though stated on his resume. Who are this 'they'? Answer is Singaporean also.

People everytime said that getting a foreigner means lower budget. Depending on the class also lah....Foreign talent cost 30% more than any same qualified Singaporean ah..

I can now see also many foreign talent doing 'karanguni' works. I'm sure everyone do notice this.

I have considered myself lucky to still hold a job though the fact my pay is like 50% lower compared to 10 years ago. To me, that's enough for me to lower my wings. But, I'm not sure I wanna retire here in old age.

Saluti!
Tetragrammaton

 

[Dime]

To see such happenings going on in this country and decisions made by our governments about foreigners may hinder the country's future prospect (refering to teenagers who are pursuing their diploma etc.)

Sooner or later students may see that its useless to get a proper certificate and not be given a proper job in due time.They may think that studying will be a waste of time.Just my view that may come in the future.

 

[theliverevolution]

I think we partly have ourselves to blame. Ask any young married couple out there whether they are going to have kids. The most likely reply would be either 2 maximum, or none at all. The trend of having absolutely no children is becoming more common. I don't know why and I cannot comprehend that logic but that's just me.

With the amount of stress that the government puts on us as humans, how not to think small? We are so busy (and stressed) with work that our sex lives are dropping. It's proven that stress can contribute to the possibility of conceiving.
And its only recently then they upped the baby bonus. ONLY RECENTLY. Sustaining children is expensive, but the government is not giving us incentives to have more children.
I remember a friend who was telling me her parents were so stressed, cause her brother (who is 4th in the family) did not qualify for Edusave and had to pay everything in full. Prior to 2004, only the 1st, 2nd and 3rd kids were eligible, and its only THIS YEAR that they opened it up to ALL students in primary and secondary school
I know a couple who has 5 kids. Shikes. Thankfully the system has changed already
But bring it back to my point on the stress life as well. A lot of working adults are stress out like crazy. Work has inevitably taken priority over family. If the government wants to really improve families, then they should do a few things:
1) Increase maternity leave/benefits
I think that 12 weeks after the baby is born is still relatively insufficient. They should seriously increase it so that mothers can have more time with their babies. Did you know that mothers who give birth to their third child are only entitled to half their monthly salary (per month passed)? So, if the benefits are not going to help them past 2 children, do we see why some females won't want to give brith to more than 2 kids? (esp those working ones, and more so, the high-flyers)
2) Introduce paternity leave
Fathers aren't entitled to paternity leave. Why can't they spend time with the children?!
3) Increase baby bonus
I've just checked a few sites, and although the baby bonus looks quite a nice sum per child, perhaps they can increase the amount as well, especially since the prices of everything is rising like crazy. Also noted, was that there was nothing said beyond the 5th child.
Hmm... better ask my friend how much they got for their 5th child.

The Govt. knows this full well, they've been bitching about the whole ageing population and our inability to (what's the word? I'll just use) replenish our population. So they see bringing in foreigners as a solution, or one part of a big solution because I am pretty sure foreigners alone won't help that much.

Alamak, the government doesn't recognise certain major flaws in some policies. It's always like that

And taking up our University places, although I really dread this, it isn't a particularly bad thing. That's just how life works. Since they are, in the eyes of the university, more 'valuable and qualified', they take the places in our stead. Happens in all kinds of places and organisations and I must say it isn't unfair, unless a university sets out to be a Singaporean-Only university.

If you notice, in the US and UK, there is a certain number of slots that are solely for the foreigners. US is small though, the universitys can only accept 5% of their students from foreign countries. Perhaps this has got to do with local demand and supply. Yet again, I don't study there.
I can't seem to get any figures about how many foreign students are studying here in our local unis, but I bet its at least a 2-digit figure. I'm not talking about those who studied in Singapore for a log time and naturally go to uni. I'm talking about those who study here just for the education.
Its ironic that Singapore try to retain people to stay in Singapore and not go overseas when most of us aren't even sure if we can pursue further education in Singapore. Admit it, there are better chances overseas. A lot of my friends go overseas, and become so used to it that they themselves admit that they do not want to come back to Singapore. They've their reasons

 

[Lifehouse]

If you notice, in the US and UK, there is a certain number of slots that are solely for the foreigners. US is small though, the universitys can only accept 5% of their students from foreign countries. Perhaps this has got to do with local demand and supply. Yet again, I don't study there.
I can't seem to get any figures about how many foreign students are studying here in our local unis, but I bet its at least a 2-digit figure. I'm not talking about those who studied in Singapore for a log time and naturally go to uni. I'm talking about those who study here just for the education.
Its ironic that Singapore try to retain people to stay in Singapore and not go overseas when most of us aren't even sure if we can pursue further education in Singapore. Admit it, there are better chances overseas. A lot of my friends go overseas, and become so used to it that they themselves admit that they do not want to come back to Singapore. They've their reasons

In regards to the foreign universities allocations for international students, the actual amount is definitely not 5%. My info is correct up to late 2008. In fact, some universities in Canada have international population of more than 30%. It's good business when international students pay more than 3 times more than the local students would.

I do agree that the slot allocation for local universities has Singaporeans at an disadvantage since the requirements for international students tend to be lower. But do note that this is not just a unique case here.

It's not that many Singaporeans do not want to pursue an education overseas but the fact still remains that many families here do not have the means to send their children abroad. For many people, the only route for them to go overseas for their studies is an all-paid scholarship. Softies who have studied overseas in the last couple of years would probably understand the total expenses incurred yearly. What's the point of having better chances overseas if one can't even afford to stay there in the first place?

That being said, chances are I'll move overseas by the time I'm 35 which ironically is the age where many firms will consider me to be "old".