any church band bassist here?

[exin]

hayubusa: i'm sorry but i have to disagree that hitting the wrong note will sound fine even though it's still within the scale and key. I have myself on many occasions hit the wrong note and though i'm in the scale and key, the interval i was playing in relation to the chord sounded wayyyyy off ...

therefore, stares from my musicians, so ... you have to hit the right notes in terms of laying down the root ... even doing fills, you have to do to it tastefully, or else it'll just sound weird.

 

[DarkRed]

ill have to agree with the couple of posts on 'wrong' notes. i tend to play 'off root' a fair bit too... but having said that, i think the role of the bassist in the majority of songs we play (even more so for contemporary church music) is still to anchor the root/chord. departing from it should only be done in appropriate times / places... such as part of a deliberate repeated musical phrase, or a fill to mark the end of a segment of music etc.

no shame at all in doing what you're there to do, and getting the job done

as for inspiration, sing along to the CD yourself.. and sometimes you might sing a little counter melody / echo / something at certain places. transcribe them and use parts of what you transcribe as a fill... tts usually pretty musical + authentic stuff

 

[hayabusa]

guys,

thanks for the advice. when i cincai, i have some techniques. haha.. made you all so worried.. don't be so horrified, won't mess up the song :wink: um.. actually improvising is the correct word here. of course i apply all the (little bit) theory i know. rest assured, i know well enough what note will compliment, and what will sound weird. because hitting the wrong notes have happened to me so many times. definately not cincai to the extend of wacking simply any note on the fretboard. i'll rather shoot myself than be caught dead playing like that on stage! :lol:

so, for example when i get lost, my rule is to return to to the root, and run around there for a while, then i work up from there. when i do this i play softly. from the root, i can estimate where the present note is. Depending on whether the key of the song is major or minor, i can somehow sense how the song flows. after i 'catch' the song, i'll remember it as a pattern on the fretboard rather than alphabets on a paper. much easier that way to remember a song.

not exactly always true, but most p&w songs tend to run around the the same pattern. the challenge is to be able to figure out the note fast because most p&w song chords changes very fast.

if my improvisation does not seem to work, i'll rather stop than spoil the song further.

thankfully my folks are very forgiving. already so glad someone is willing to play the bass. to begin with, i wasn't even a bassist when i was asked to join the music team i was a solo classical guitarist. we were so short-handed back then. being so used to working alone, my big time problem then was keeping in time with the band. thankfully i'm so much more competent now. still learing, still learning..

we encourage one another. after all, we're in a band and if one member screws up while playing, the music still goes on up as there're others to back up. man, are we bassist really such an endangered species? i mean for every 10 musicisan, 7 are guitarist, 2 keyboardist and only one bassist

 

[warwickw]

For every 20 musicians, there are 10 drummers, 7 guitarists, 2 keyboardists and only a bassist =)

 

[rylche]

Haha. I think for 20, 12 guitarists, 3 drummers, 3 keyboardists and 2 bassists.

 

[Z3r0_G]

arent we so glad to be in demand? =D

 

[exin]

that's why bass players need to be solid.

 

[warwickw]

Tat's y we get the gigs, but no time to play them all =)

 

[hayabusa]

my lead guitarist never bother to follow the songs. he'll just ask for the key and goreng on his own. in return, he steals the show instead. wish we bassist can do that too.

that's one of the reason wny not many people interested in fat strings. shallow minded people adore the skinny but we know big is beautiful 8)

 

[litford]

yah.... we're so deep because it resonates with the same deep tone of our instrument...

-p sorry, long day, getting a bit sarcastic.. at least e have a sense of humour! i hope? -)

 

[jeremyrozario]

i'm a lead guitarist on a bass...too many guitarists and drummers, gotta have a bassist, and i switched camps since...

for me, i'll run through the chord progression until i know it like the back of my hand, as in all the roots, den i work from there, maybe arpeggiate a bit, add in a 3rd or a major 7th, slide up an octave and stuff, or maybe climb with 3rd to 4th to 5th...stuff liddat, basically make the song my own, but still keep the song somewhat familiar

 

[warwickw]

I think wat's nice bout bass is that the bass line styles can help to drive the band into any style. Eg drummer plays a simple beat, bassist can determine the style of the band if he wanna play shuffle, swing, rock, funk etc... ghost notes make a lot of diff too in adding groove

I also realise that most keyboardists always play the bass notes in the same range as the bassists. So sometimes if the bassist stops playing there's no diff in the music. Anyone ever experience this before?

 

[Colarndo]

Yeah, but it's the timbre of the bass and the harmonic frequencies that resonate that sets us apart from the keyboard.

 

[hayabusa]

long day indeed.. i didn't expect so many responses to this tread. normally we bassist quite sleepy ya.. must be god's work around here :wink:

now we're getting into a fat vs skinny argument, least we forget the the original motive of this tread, which is to share on 'ad-hoc' playing. before that, here's more fuel to the fire. hehe..

why bass?
a bass solo can stand on it's own- think vic wooten. but a guitar solo needs the backing of a drum and bass. a guitar solo alone sounds just as pleasant as a mosquito flying at your ear

now back to the topic.

earlier i mentioned about improvising. here's my techniques. now, it's a case by case technique and happens to work for me but might not work for the kind of songs you play. here goes..

when i play the song the first time, i make note of the key and notes of the song. exin is right when he/she(?) mentioned about hitting wrong notes and sounding weird, even if the notes are in the same scale. oh btw i'm a he 8) .

let's say the song is in the key of c, and chords used are c (root), g(5th), f(4th), d(2nd) and e(3rd). when i get lost, my method is to appergiate among these notes. by god's grace, it worked for me most of the time. in this case, accidentally hitting the remaining notes a(6th) and b(7th) is tricky and does pose a risk of sounding weird. so my rule is to avoid notes that are not used in the song. then again, if you're an expert, by all means, do use the full range of the scale and create magic.

next, it's important to know some theory on chord construction. for example, a c chord is made of c, e and g. so, if you hit g or e against a c chord, most likely you're able with it. i've experimented with my guitarist. he played a progression in C and i played it in G. we got an intersting effect. (C and G are good friends because G is the 5th of C, and therefore very complimenting)

so, the more ugly chords say Dm7sus4 ( then add 4, minus 6 add susu add kopi bla bla bla.. :lol: ) has a wider range of notes in it. that's good for the bassist, because it gives more options to fall on.

so, that's about all my method. i call it "damage control". feel free to give constructive comments or share your methods

 

[warwickw]

Personally I think to pedal on the 5th (aka G) would be a better option, then wait for the cue from the keyboardist to resolve to the 1 and carry on with the song. If the keyboardist also lost, then all the best already =)

Playing the root is what the rest of the band likes to hear. So if it's a D7sus4, bassist plays the D, keyboardist plays the C (and yes he plays the C on the left hand instead of the D). A lot depends on the voicings of the keyboardist or guitarist to add the flavour, bass just gives the 'depth' in the chord.

 

[exin]

warwickw: YES! Many times i've had keyboard players who play so much in the range of the bass guitar that when i stop playing there's no difference, actually, when i stop playing it sounded nicer. So i had to actually get my keyboard player to play higher, it works if you open your mouth to tell them.

it's a disease for some keyboard players not to play higher

 

[litford]

i suppose they're just too used to being the lead instrument in scenarios like that.

chances are, our keyboardists is classically trained, and of course that's a great thing, but sometimes it gets in the way if you're trying to do things as a band.

band dynamics are probably as important as being technically proficient. i dunno, but i feel that's where a lot of our problems lie, not just in terms of proficiency, but the overall musicality of the band as a unit, not 5 different instrumentalists

 

[exin]

litford: agreed.

 

[rylche]

+1 Litford. My brother, who has completed grade 8 in Piano theory and practical, can't really jam with me at home! Plays way too much and whams hard on the left hand.

 

[exin]

yeah, it's the classically-trained piano syndrome ...

but .. for classically-trained pianist who break out of that mould .. goodness .. they become so good after that ..