The truth about keyboard USB-MIDI connection

[Cheez]

There has been some questions lately about whether the USB-MIDI connection from keyboards function as well as standalone midi interfaces. Well, my experiece:

My S90 just arrived last week. Last night tried the USB MIDI connection from the keyboard - plugged directly into my notebook running Gigastudio. First of all, there's no noticeable latency - the same as my midi interface. Fast playing etc has no problems - the midi signals goes through fine. But when I start using the mod wheel, I actually get hanged notes. The system however did not crash - I do need to restart my softsampler though. This does not happen with my external midi interface, ever. In fact, it has never happen before in any other circumstances. It appears that when there's a sudden surge of large midi signals being sent, the driver was not stable enough to handle it.

This is only for Yamaha's generic driver. Anybody else has any other experiences with keyboard's USB connections with Yamaha or other brands? For me, it's back to my M-audio's midi interface.

 

[lowjk]

This is only for Yamaha's generic driver. Anybody else has any other experiences with keyboard's USB connections with Yamaha or other brands? For me, it's back to my M-audio's midi interface.

No problem with Edirol PCR-1 and M-audio Midisport 8x8.

Maybe it's Yamha way of encouraging you to switch to their mLan system (but then you have to upgrade to the S90 ES) :lol:

But seriously, have you upgraded your driver? (model answer from tech support).

 

[bongman]

oh boy? Tech manuafacturers always have their way to force users to another arena ??? errrr.... ?

 

[Cheez]

My driver is the latest. They do have a firewire option - but must get their firewire card. Maybe it's just a Yamaha thing. Looks like I'll stick to good 'ol midi interface. No way I'll go into M-lan or V-link or whatever.

Lowjk, you mentioned PCR-1 and Midisport 8x8. I'm pretty sure there's no problem connecting via the midisport. But just want to confirm if you have any problems with the Edirol connected directly to your PC via USB without the midisport - particularly when using lots of mod wheel changes etc.

 

[lowjk]

Lowjk, you mentioned PCR-1 and Midisport 8x8. I'm pretty sure there's no problem connecting via the midisport. But just want to confirm if you have any problems with the Edirol connected directly to your PC via USB without the midisport

Er, the PCR-1 is directly connected by USB (because it has no MIDI ports).
So far so good. The system has just been hooked up and I'm still feeling my way around. But no delays or errors on playing.

The Midisport 8x8 is on another system. I'm connected via USB, not via the serial port. Also no problem here. (actually there was, but it has been solved with a firmware upgrade from M-audio - mailed the chips from USA FOC!).

 

[Cheez]

Oh. Pai seh. Didn't know the PCR-1 connects via USB only.

I'm pretty sure USB midi interfaces (external) are pretty stable. It's those that are built into keyboards that I'm now beginning to doubt. Well, thought I may get rid of extra wires by connecting directly. Looks like I'll have to live with the tangle of wires.

 

[LuZeR]

Cheez!

How much did you bought the S90 for? and where?

 

[Cheez]

Not from Singapore since I'm not in Singapore. And not cheap. S$3800 (not in SG currency of course). That's the cheapest I can get from here. Got a free X-stand and a lousy sustain pedal which I'm getting them to change to a Yamaha 3-in-1 pedal - which they agreed.

 

[LuZeR]

Can someone confirm this?

I asked a friend to check the Yamaha store at PS and he told me the S90 costs $4629 and the S90ES $4500. He told me that over the phone and i was like,"What?!?!?!? Are you serious?"

Is it true that the S90ES is slightly cheaper than the S90? I thought S90ES being the new and improved version of S90 would be more expensive and that it will cause a drop in price of the S90 but am I hearing things or my friend saw the wrong price tag? LOL

 

[bongman]

Motif ES8 selling at $5100, you get more sounds
and it's the flagship synth.

 

[Cheez]

But, if you don't need the build-in sequencer, the extra money can be spend on the plug-in modules. Extra sounds can be downloaded from the S90/S90ES dedicated website - some free sound sets there.

How much is one plug-in module anyway?

 

[LuZeR]

Bongman - ES 8 for $5100, is that from Yamaha PS? I recently emailed Luthermusic and they quoted me $5700 for it.

Cheez - Yea it is true what u say abt the built-in sequencers. I have never found the need to use/have it so I can definitely live without it and yea, I would use the money saved to get plug in cards. If i were to buy the S90/S90ES, most probably I would wanna get the XG card and the VL card. But i have no idea how much it costs though lol.

On a side note, given that the S90/S90ES boasts a good sounding piano, is it worth getting the Ultimate Piano plug in card?

 

[bongman]

Bongman - ES 8 for $5100, is that from Yamaha PS? I recently emailed Luthermusic and they quoted me $5700 for it.

Motif ES8 usual price is about SG$6000++
current sale 'til 31Dec is $5100++
(check out website pdf sale)

M'sia Yamaha selling Motif ES8 at about RM$12,000++,
so about SG$5200++

check them out !

 

[Cheez]

On a side note, given that the S90/S90ES boasts a good sounding piano, is it worth getting the Ultimate Piano plug in card?

It all depends on your needs and what you feel about the sounds. the S700 3-layer sound in the S90 is OK, but too "tingly" to me ears. I have not tried the CIII piano in the new plug-in. But I'm spoiled by samples - so any hardware piano will not sound good to be anymore.

The VL never gave me a good impression. It is good technology, but it still sounds fake to my ears, not to mention they are monophonic. I will not get XG sounds either. If I have a choice - it will either be the analog, the FM or the ultimate piano. But don't forget you have to buy monitor spekaers if you don't already have a pair.

 

[lowjk]

I will not get XG sounds either.

I wouldn't go as far as making this a "universal truth",
XG Midi Synths when sequenced properly sounds miles better than the garden variety General Midi Synths.

I was blown away when I heard the DBXG50 the very first time 10 years ago. At times, I wondered whether I was listening to an audio recording or a midi file.

And I had a Roland JV1080 at that time.

 

[Silencer]

by and large i don't get problems with the yamaha midi drivers. i downloaded the latest generic yamaha midi usb driver and used it with my rack and keyboard. my set up links my keyboard to the computer, and computer to the rack. no lag time as far as i could tell, but there would be a sudden surge of notes whenever i open my sequencing software, or whenever i open the yamaha studio manager software.

other than that, it seems to be functioning perfectly normal.

 

[Cheez]

I don't have problems playing notes. I used up 160 notes polyphony on my Gigastudio with a 14-layered piano playing very fast notes - no glitch/pops/clicks at all with near zero latency. The problem arises with using other controllers - like the mod wheel. It's here when notes hang. I use mod wheels/faders etc very freqeuntly.

 

[qfactor]

I agree. The common "complaint" is that GM/GS/XG stds restrict one from using more original sounds, but sometimes, when compatibility is the order of the day, we are compelled to use the standards and have to be "creative within the limits".

Having said that, XG does give a LOT of control over the timbre of its "GM" sounds, in addition to the many variations of instruments it provides, I would agree to its superiority over the other "standards".

QF

I wouldn't go as far as making this a "universal truth",
XG Midi Synths when sequenced properly sounds miles better than the garden variety General Midi Synths.

:wink: