Not suitable to sing at all

well, if u phrased it as" hmm, actually i don believe in using diaphargm " instead of, "dude, there is no point of using the diaphragm" i woudnt even post a 2nd post there.

what im trying to do is to explain to him some basics which he could really use to improve and not just " singing is a natural thing". how would he comprehend that?

im still curious what you used to support your breath thou. Even if its natural, there must be something which u are using to support, so pls don tell me "its natural" or i'll tell u to eat grass.
 
I meant diaphragm Theory(harden stomach muscles). Yes diaphragm controls air pressure to allow air to enter thoracic cavity. (The diaphragm is an important of course!)
Pushing down on the diaphragm = support? What is breath support. How you breathe? You breathe when you have too much carbon dioxide in your lungs and you need to control it? NO! Why do the extra work when the brain can do it for you?
I aint saying you are wrong, I just said i dont believe it. It is my technique and it worked well for me. So i guessed that it will work well for him too. I am giving him my honest feedback and the best advices i can think of for this guy. No hard feelings though, under years of training i was not mentioned of hardening diaphragm.
If you are a professional, you meant you gonna remember to harden your stomach muscles for one and a half hours? Just giving my honest comments.
Okay in my choir years i did come across your technique, it worked as in blasting out air to my cord yes( damaging my cords, yes!). Loudness there? Yes. Strain there? Another yes to that!
Tell me your opinion of my reply.Thanks
 
(there is no point using diaphragm) Oppx i did not notice this Really sorry. I also meant no point thinking so much of using diaphragm. Sorry for misunderstanding i thought i only write the theory part.
 
well, at the start, when one isnt familiar with using it yet, u'll have to remember. But after a few times, ur body familiarizes with it and it becomes a habit, its like what u said, practice the right habits and discarding bad ones.

Its suppose to be tighten and not harden. harden makes it sound like your putting all your might in your stomach, that's y i used the word "tighten" instead.

about blasting the air out, u don blast it ,u control the rate of air which comes out from ur lungs. i dont think u can control it better with throat or chest muscles rite? lip thriling is a great way to practice this, u dont use too much or too little air in that exercise.

from my first post,"when u sing it out, keep the slighly tight feeling of ur stomach there"
i dint say tighten and blast, but, when u take in air into your lower lungs, u will feel the little tightness in ur stomach and try to keep that slight tightness when u sing.

im guessing u are already beyond the stage of basic singing, and for u, u dont have to think of using the diaphragm since it comes naturally now, but for him it might not be the case. using the diaphragm would most likely help him chain up his words together too =).
 
well, at the start, when one isnt familiar with using it yet, u'll have to remember. But after a few times, ur body familiarizes with it and it becomes a habit, its like what u said, practice the right habits and discarding bad ones.

Its suppose to be tighten and not harden. harden makes it sound like your putting all your might in your stomach, that's y i used the word "tighten" instead.

about blasting the air out, u don blast it ,u control the rate of air which comes out from ur lungs. i dont think u can control it better with throat or chest muscles rite? lip thriling is a great way to practice this, u dont use too much or too little air in that exercise.

from my first post,"when u sing it out, keep the slighly tight feeling of ur stomach there"
i dint say tighten and blast, but, when u take in air into your lower lungs, u will feel the little tightness in ur stomach and try to keep that slight tightness when u sing.

im guessing u are already beyond the stage of basic singing, and for u, u dont have to think of using the diaphragm since it comes naturally now, but for him it might not be the case. using the diaphragm would most likely help him chain up his words together too =).

True True, my mistake on that. Thanks for your detailed explaination
 
JIanrong,

Do you want to perform with your singing for gigs etc.? If so then obviously the quality of your voice is important. But if not, who cares what others say. The gift of singing can be used for your own pleasure and the more you practice the better you will get.

Just like with working out, the muscles related to your voice in the throat/diaphragm, will become more toned and you will gradually have more control over your voice.

A good voice is largely due to having control over it. Believe me, I am a professional singer and have been singing for many years and every year my voice improves.

Don't give up, if you truely love singing you can get voice coaching and plenty of practice, believe me you WILL improve. Everyone is capable of improving their voice. It all depends on how much work you are willing to put in.

All the best
 
JIanrong,


A good voice is largely due to having control over it. Believe me, I am a professional singer and have been singing for many years and every year my voice improves.

Don't give up, if you truely love singing you can get voice coaching and plenty of practice, believe me you WILL improve. Everyone is capable of improving their voice. It all depends on how much work you are willing to put in.

All the best

OK, I'm not JianRong here, but Beth250 that is very reassuring. Thank you. :)
 
Hey Ron,

Its great to see that you are still working hard on your dreams :)
Its been ages since we last met, lets have a K-session soon yea?


As to your topic, the biggest advise that i can give still goes back to the basics.

1. Breath control. Knowing how to do diaphragm inhaling is not enuff, you need to control your exhale in order to control the sentence.
You need to control your own breath before you can control your voice projection, position, and even diction. This is the basic that i cant stress enough. You need to solve this problem before you proceed on to the next point, which is to improve your diction and voice projection.

2. Open your mouth and jaw to pronounce every single word in full. Stop your singing for now.
Take the lyrics of your favourite song, take a deep breath into your lower abs, then open your mouth to read and pronounce every word out loud and clear. Use air supply from your lower abs.

3. If you want to improve, then you have to be able to listen and think.
Listen to yourself more, and think how you can improve, think how to go about doing it. To improve, you need to think more than you sing. There is really no point going to ktv again and again and practise the wrong habits again and again.

Once you are ready, start by practising easier songs first. Get your breath control, projection, diction, rythm sense right first, before you move on to songs that requires more techniques / tougher songs.

Yu tian, and pu tong peng you <-- these are out of the question, if you wanna practise and improve your basics.
 
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Well, thanks for all comments. Yah, i believe i am not total tone deaf. Just that hitting on the wrong pitch as someone mention, the wrong semi tones. Probably due to me singing the song in my own key rather then the singer key?

Here the youtube link from ktv.

Samuel Tai - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8ELEhUJW-M&feature=channel_page

David Tao - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DCHF-MOFOo&feature=channel_page

And hey engboon, long time no listen to your daniel chan alike vocal. Drop me an sms when u are free to sing ktv. Me should be able to at weekend. Plus, i never use my christian name anymore as they does sound Wrong. Just call me by my chinese name will do.
 
hey dude

hey dun get too upset.. while i believe everyone has to a chance to sing.. it's only a matter of fact if u've worked hard enough but whichever if the case.. since u like x-japan and perhaps u would like to be in band.. maybe u could pick up guitar, bass or drums.. perhaps keyboard too.. in that case u can enjoy music and who knows u're born with a musician fingers. :) all the best.. dun give up on music.. music is something everyone should have a chance to enjoy .. work hard will get u something. :)
 
Hi TS, I agree with most of the people who have given you advice.

In addition I would encourage you to work on your phrasing. Also control your airflow when you emote. Not many people can be like Jay Chou and kek all the time haha.

When you speak, you will have a phrase or flow of your words yea? For eg,

My name is John. You wouldn't say My, name is, John.

So when you sing, please do take note of these small things. Practise verse by verse. I believe it will help you to improve.
 
forget the contests, instructors etc. do ur own thing, just let your voice go with the music. just ensure the pitching does not go off pitch. u'l b ok
 
Yu tian

Hey I heard your recording. I agree with your instructor Daniel that your diction needs to be improve.

I heard parts of your YU TIAN, your pronounciation of many of the words are wrong.

Seriously in my opinion, don't give up! Because at least you manage to grab the pitch and rhyme. There are some people out there who are tone deaf and rhyme idiots yet they still manage to sing.

Your only BIG problem is your diction and pronounciation. Before you sing the lyric, read it aloud once, twice or many times. Get someone who have good chinese pronounciation to guide you in the chinese word. Once you clear your speech problem, I believe you can sing! :)

Anyway the headvoice at the last part of YU TIAN, you can be stronger cause it is the climax

Cheers!
 
I don't want to be a Simon. I just want you to face reality.

Its fine if you wanna sing KTV. It totally is. But i get what Daniel is trying to say.

You can't sing for a competition. You can, however, sing with friends and family. Thats fine.

There's just too much things to comment on your singing that i wouldn't bother listing them down.

Maybe its the song choice, maybe its the technicality, maybe its fundamentals. But face it. You can't sing. At least for competitions.

God is fair. Most blind people sing well. People who are blind in 1 eye have perfect vision in the other. People who are paralyzed are geniuses.

And God gave everyone a talent. Singing isn't yours. You've got to start searching what your talent is. And accept it.

But if you want to sing with family and friends, ITS TOTALLY FINE.
 
I spoke to Daniel about this, and there was a misunderstanding there. What jianrong heard was not what Daniel intended to say.

Jianrong, I get that you aren't interested in resolving this, but I don't think it's fair that you misrepresent him here in the forum.
 
Btherl, for all you know, jianrong misinterpreted Daniel. No one's at fault. If Daniel's reputation stands, a 1 time thing won't affect it.
 
Going to Daniel won't change anything unless

Hi Jian Rong

Personally what i feel abt singing is not how good you are but how much you want it. Everybody can sing! if ppl say u can't sing then let them say it. I mean feeling sad and all abt comments is fine but it's gotta be beyond that. But what matters most is the hard work. going to daniel won't change anything unless you internalize his teachings and this takes alot of time. Don't give up but at the same time don't be in a hurry to see results. Improvement will come once you realize and understand your teacher. Yeap i had vocal training as well, it was difficult but it took years before i really had improvement. Sing for passion

Cheerios,

keith
 
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hi!

it's a happy thing to sing... but went you give yourself too much stress... the music turn sour... try to be more relax... i heard the music from your link... definately not the worst i heard... but really need to polish up... anyway thumbs up for your courage!!
 
Hi Jianrong

I listened to some of the links and people commented about the english and mandarin diction not really clear. I think I know why lah bro. You either Malay-speaking or Tamil-speaking lah, right?

Haha bro i'm just kidding, I see the thread like I have alot of emotions, from first pity you, then listen to the clip I'm baffled by some remarks, then blur because got science lesson on diaphragm but all very fun to read (no offence to all contributors! =P )

Anyway dude, I think alot of people are right. You sing for fun, then doesn't matter. You take classes is to try improve, no matter what level. If they think you cannot improve, then that's their opinion. You keep on singing, you happy can already. See my nick? Happiness is most important.

Whoever says you cannot sing ah, quite extreme. You CAN sing. But just how well only lah. People say need to improve diction, this I agree. Like how we say the word "world", we slang the letter "r" kao kao also but never pronounce the letter "d" also same same but different but still same same lah, not best diction. All you need is to ENJOY the whole idea of singing, instead of setting out to really sing for a couple of hours a day or something.

ANyway bro, I always feel that mandarin songs and english songs need a different kind of voice and style of singing. My wife, Jolin / Yi Lin, can never do a cover of English songs well. S.H.E. also. Cos

Actually hor I think no matter what people say, it's all about you being happy. If you happy join competition, then join. You happy singing, then sing. If you think got improvement and you happy, so be it.

But most importantly bro, I think you got balls to start a self-depreciating thread. And that will make some girls happy. And you will also happy.

When you are passionate about something, success will follow. Your passion is to sing and sing well. My passion is to tell Jolin face-to-face to marry me. One day success will follow us both. Good luck bro.
 
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