more organisers organizing "pay to play" gigs

[ffadzill]

What i've noticed these days that alot of gig organisers organising "pay to play"
gigs. I somehow disagree on this concept. I do respect that they are trying
to organise gigs and letting new/old bands a chance to expose themselves or expose more...

But nowadays bands have to sell tix to play on gigs so that they can cover cost of the rental of gig places(forgive me if im wrong). These will be difficult for bands that have just started out. They may be good,awesome or terrible but imagine that when they wanna play gigs,they have to fork out money.This is not so good for the scene.And furthermore, usually bands that play pay to play gigs will sell tix to their friends and they will go like "Hey i got a gig coming up but we have to sell tix to play...You wanna come?Tix is 10bux."

These ppl that pay for the tix wuld most probably pay to only see their friends band play and then they head home or somewhere else.
For me this is somehow not good. I myself have played in pay to play gigs and once,we even have to fork out alotta moolah to invite our friends to come and see us as we were new band back then. yes we do have alot of friends that came but after watching us they head to somewhere else.
We kinda feel disappointed on the gig as most ppl that came only watched their friends band play. This is only my experience and im sure that other bands somehow feel the same way too...

So dear friends,gig organisers,musicians, i urge u guys to look into this matter for the good of the scene..u may agree/disagree with me bbut hey this is only just my opinion and i noe that this kinda thread has been the talk of the town recently.

So i hope that gigs in the future will not be like this and i can tell u that all bands in sg,musicians,moshers,headbangers,shoegazers will all be 1 happy family. To those who read this thread,i really appreciate it...thank you!


p.s. to pay to play gig organisers: Y not fund urself or get a group of dudes or dudettes,save moo 1st then organise. Please do not rush on organizing and in the end do not have enuf moolah or watsoever. Plan 1st,have sufficient fund and then organize...in that way,i hope or am sure that you and bands that play will be happy and will pput up a hell of a show.

 

[EngelFaeuste]

I don't want to put it too harshly to you, but that is the way it is in Singapore, you don't have a scene. That is the end of it. I think the standard of the bands here has something to do with it as well.

Anyway, please do not complain, from what I've heard, the guys in Sydney have it worse, sometimes, they literally have to PAY the pub owners to let them PLAY and expose themselves. Yeap, cold hard cash, NOT selling tickets.

Anyway, I've been on both sides of the coin before, trust me, organizing a gig is a real nightmare. Bands turn up late, they whine, they complain, they sound like rhinos doing the Irish riverdance. Please spare a thought for the organizers who have to do all the paperwork and such, do you think it is as easy as you think it is?

Let's face the world for what it is, money say "jump", world asks "how high?". Again, it is profit that drives organizers to do what they do. I'd expect them to exploit the bands to hell. Organizers need to make money or they wouldn't want to organize anything. Besides, I think the amount one makes for weeks of planning - about a thousand quid - is quite reasonable.

 

[soft]

Hey ffadzill

I think having bands to sell the tickets is alright. Putting together a show is not easy. If a band cannot even get their friends/relatives to come and support them, I don't know who else will support them.

We are talking about new bands with zero reputation, fan base or attraction. In this case, the bands have to work much harder to break into the market.

Furthermore, the bands have a choice not to participate in these "p2p" gigs. If they feel they can do better organising a gig on their own, they are more than welcome to do it and maybe even invite other bands to play in their gigs.

 

[theliverevolution]

hard to say about this sort of things. new bands must be able to showcase themselves well before they get paid to play. honestly, what happens if the bands, especially new ones, come and do a really crappy act? At least if they pay to play, the organisers can reclaim some money to cover up for the losses.

and also it showcases one thing:

if the band is good, organisers would invite them back free of charge and eventually pay them to play.
if they're crap... well... too bad

 

[extremers]

hey ffadzill,

im sorry but the scene have to survive partially on p2p gigs too. it's done all over the world and it's normal.

organizers are not going to plan gigs if events keep on landing them with heavy losses despite proper planning unless their gigs are lined up with decent bands (therefore noob bands hardly have a chance in performing since they picked decent bands).

and without constant gigs (be it sponsored or diy/p2p) the scene will die out.

p2p gigs is a platform for the zero-reputation newly formed bands to get into the scene. alternatively, there are competitions for noob bands to showcase their talents too in which, some comes with a small application fee.

but which would you rather choose; a competition which enables you to play 1 - 2 songs on stage or paying for a full set of 30 - 45 mins?

im sorry there isn't much choices for noob bands to jumpstart but i believe we can always make the better choice; either pay 2 play or trying your luck in competitions (or even better if you manage to rope in a couple of noob bands to share the rent cost and organize your own gigs)

and as EngelFaeuste mentioned, i know of bands in australia having to bring their own equipment (amps and stuff) just to gig. that on top of paying for the venue rent at a small pub and stuff. i feel pretty lucky that we have the equipments provided here in singapore (in most cases that is).

anyways, whichever choice you'd make, good luck in your pursuit. i hope to share the same stage with you guys one day.

 

[ffadzill]

dear friends,

thanx for the response...
in a way i am not complaining about this..
im just saying that im seeing more and more gigs that are P2P these days.
its sumhow starting to become a trend.

yes, i myself have been in p2p gigs.
like i said i honour organiozers efforts to organize.
profit is 1 thing...having a hell of a show is another..
and i still do not mind playing p2p gigs these days.
just have to be reasonable.like the no. of tix and price.
so far its ok.

to all those that gave their opinios so far...thank u!
mr extremers-thanx!!

 

[wylde]

pay to play gigs are ok for me.....but sometimes i believe that some of the organisers are quite young and inexperienced..like for example,

1.no sound check(if ask them why?..they say that before the band plays,just do some minor soundcheck,not to mention that it eats up the whole band`s 1`2 hr slot..)
2.very bad sound technician(and i really mean very bad)
3.no proper experience in handling too many bands and just needlessly changing timeslots

but, i believe that feeback is given and hope that they learn from it..
anyway...............p2p gigs are ok by me...just my 2 cans worth

 

[AEnimic]

Pay to play gigs keeps the scene not congested. The bands that never took the effort to promote through friends before hand and make a myspace account or a facebook account to reach out, then they will have a tough time when they finally have a gig.

At first I don't support selling tix (there are still organisers that rip bands off through this method), but somehow I realise that by this method of organising, it's the only way to keep the scene clear from overcrowding of bands that don't deserve the stage or don't have the drive to sacrifice.

 

[biopromax]

Yes, theres some organizers who have bravely put up a show. By P2P method. Meaning to say , they have no money to organize but they wanna let bands to play. But bo bian ah, make the bands help by selling tix to cover cost.Thru p2p method. I think its alright ah.

But some by P2P method, they clearly wanna make the bands bankrupt. They use the money for own usage. Those are people who are making use of the bands. I know they wanna earn abit but not until make profits then everything keep to own pockets. hehe.

What I suggests is , if you wana organize and have no capital, start off small. Organize with few bands/friends, chip in money and no worries about losses at all. PLAY at ease..

So those new bands, be wary on which event/gig you are going to perform.
Its all about Trust AND Integrity.

WE understand you.



I know i speak too much but no action.

WhatLah! project is on hiatus now. Will be back really soon. With zero P2P method, all through our saving accounts.

and also don't forget to change your ezlink card to the new one!

 

[extremers]

how biopro, LOLS3 this year? DIY ALL THE WAY!

 

[biopromax]

Yes! Hope to find more time for the local music scene. The camp is too much for me to handle, so many in camps

So those who wanna be part of the LOLS series, do tell me.

See ya guys tmrw at SAM!

 

[extremers]

i want to be part of LOLS3

 

[ffadzill]

i totally agree with mr biopromax...
thanx dude....

 

[syed_zack]

weell i guesss the solution fer p2p is well make yer own gig!or go fer comps promote yer band there as it dosnt require that much deposit and u dont have to struggel to sell tix.once u have a 'following' then either organise or join a p2p.its not all that bad of the organisers are very clear with ther intentions.but good point raised notheless ffadzil bro

 

[alfa]

p2p gigs are ok.
but some rip-off the tickets sale by selling it at a very unreasonable price.

 

[Martyn]

Well... To be frank, you can ask all the old bands that survived. 10-15 years back, they are searching for a gig and not a lot of organisers back then. Mostly local competitions & singing and performing under HDB block for frens wedding. Seriously, the local band scene changed a lot. For now, it is good to see a lot of talent in singapore. Market is small but you have to look on the bright side. It is actually a win-win situation. You have to sell tixs to help the organiser & at the same time expose your band. If you got talent, anyone can see & invite you & your band to play again. If you think the organiser charge per tixs is expensive, you can just say no anytime. CHEERS! to the Local Scene...(I.M.H.O)

 

[biopromax]

yes sure sure.. ) Love it to see local bands working together as a team and make things happen..


Anyone wanna join us to organize LOL3 really soon?

 

[twistedmelody]

F**K pay to play gigs.a chance for organisers to earn money.SOME organisers dont care about the scene.they care about earning money.

 

[blank]

well firstly, if you're good, you shouldn't have to do these types of gigs. it's pretty much a 200+ dollar 45minutes to 1hour jamming session, in front of a crowd who will give you claps no matter how badly you f uck up.
paying isn't necessarily terrible, for example if you're a bigger band organizing a gig, if you don't have enough tickets sold you're pretty much paying for that gig.
simple solution: never attend or take part in shitty shit (or, don't be a stupid piece of shit)
but only you know that now, there are always 15yr old rockstars desperate to showcase their amazing talent in the form of an awkward sweet child o' mine cover to their mother and best friend. and that is the circle of life.

 

[mockingbird]

I think the P2P is mostly aimed at the younger ones (16, 17 yrs?) who are desperate for exposure and experience. While we older ones are smart enough to know that we shouldn't be paying to play.