Memorize music pieces
- Thread starter mera
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mera
New member
My teacher suggested that I memorized the pieces to 'bring it up one level' higher. ie I'll be able to express it better, instead of looking at the notes and keys the whole time.
I saw Piano-ex's rendition of chopin in Youtube:- wow! how long does one take to memorize pieces like that?
I saw Piano-ex's rendition of chopin in Youtube:- wow! how long does one take to memorize pieces like that?
[vogue]angel
New member
well, u practice once through with the book and after that, close the book and play it out again. starting is out, but later will be oklar.
Cheez
Moderator
Go section by section. After playing it many times, you'll get to remember it. If you can't, don't worry too much. It's not a requirement of exams. I recall when I took Grade 8, I memorised every piece including the 3 movements Mozart sonata. Then disaster struck - in the halfway through the first movement, I realised I repeated one section one time too many. Anyway, managed to pass it in the end...despite that! Whew!
Cheez
Moderator
You can't memorize chord structures in classical music. It doesn't quite as well as pop piano. And going a few bars by a few bars doesn't work as well - 8 bars may end smack in the middle of a phrase which may make little musical sense and hence difficult to commit to memory. Even if you remember it, it will not help you to express it well.
My suggestion is still to go section by section. Look for double bars and take that as an end to one section. If the section is too long, look for sub-sections that make sense musically within the piece. Hence, you are not just memorising notes - you are memorising the music as a whole.
My suggestion is still to go section by section. Look for double bars and take that as an end to one section. If the section is too long, look for sub-sections that make sense musically within the piece. Hence, you are not just memorising notes - you are memorising the music as a whole.
that is not effective and very dangerous...
a bit from my knowledge
the method for memorizing (if i'm not wrong remembering this), as one of the professor actually research are:
1.motoric
2.aural
3.visual
4.harmony
5.structural
and I have been exposed to all of them and various methods that my peers in college did.
1. motoric (most of pianist's strong point, or only point)
This is the most common way that people do to memorize a song. Playing a song again and again and again, until the finger remembers it. So it's not actually you remember it, but the motoric function of your finger remembers it. But if there are one wrong note, that's it ... the connection to the next motoric activity is lost and you are at a loss. The only way to continue usually is to start from beginning (or from where you usually start when you practice) This happen usually to those who practice from beginning till the end of the song, and then go to beginning again, and to the end again .. and that goes on forever.
2. aural (one of my stronger point actually)
This is what most people with perfect pitch are blessed with... They hear the song, and they remember how it sounds. So this is how they memorize, they remember what it sounds like and play it accordingly.. which is possible for them because they have perfect pitch.
3. visual (one of my classmates have this as her strong point)
They are the people that we say have 'photographic memory'. Some have it at a greater degree, or even perfect, some only partial. They can remember the pages of the score and can recall it to their head when they're playing. So when they play without the score, actually they have the score in their head and seeing it mentally.
4. harmony (one of the more methodical classmates practices this...)
They remember each harmonic progression as they play because they practice and know it... so it'll help them a lot to remember the chord and the piece.
5. structure (my lecturer forces me to do this to enhance all the previous one)
We're trying to remember the piece with the structure, with the motifs, and everything with detailed analysis. It's possible and it's good to learn a piece away from piano, and when you do it, you'll be surprised that you can play it for the first time better =) and it trains your sightread as well (for me personally)
Now, there are no strongest way and weaker way. But what we should do is to fully utilize every way so that in a case that one way fail, we still have the other to support us. So the best way to memorize is to fully utilizing all this memorizing method to the full.
hope it helps
ps: which chopin video issit? i'm .. actually forgot about having a videos in youtube already .... oops
pf
New member
Nice one, piano_ex.
Question on the aural one......is it for perfect pitch people only? How about people with strong relative pitch? It's for people who can remember how the music goes right? The people with strong relative pitch would be able to play if they remember the piece and are able to play the right intervals. So, isn't it supposed to be the same for people with good aural skills in general?
From your description, I supposed one can start a piece with the motoric memory and then if it fails (missed a note or something), carry on with their aural memory.
Remember the old book that I read and raised the question on pedaling? The interviews with the pianists? Majority of them says they have photographic memory or memorise by studying the music away from the piano. How interesting!
Question on the aural one......is it for perfect pitch people only? How about people with strong relative pitch? It's for people who can remember how the music goes right? The people with strong relative pitch would be able to play if they remember the piece and are able to play the right intervals. So, isn't it supposed to be the same for people with good aural skills in general?
From your description, I supposed one can start a piece with the motoric memory and then if it fails (missed a note or something), carry on with their aural memory.
Remember the old book that I read and raised the question on pedaling? The interviews with the pianists? Majority of them says they have photographic memory or memorise by studying the music away from the piano. How interesting!
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mera
New member
Piano-ex: Its this ..not chopin, my mistake. YouTube - liszt Concert Etudes, Gnomenreigen & Haydn Eb Sonata
I've guess most of us rely on no.1 motoric, esp for scales. You are right, when I skip a note, everything becomes a blank.
How long does it take for u to memorize the haydn? i'll never reach there but just curious.
I've guess most of us rely on no.1 motoric, esp for scales. You are right, when I skip a note, everything becomes a blank.
How long does it take for u to memorize the haydn? i'll never reach there but just curious.
to pf:
strong relative pitch shud work the same way with perfect pitch, but of course it works differently ... =)
to mera:
erm, if i didn't remember wrongly, i think that haydn didn't took long, cuz i was rushing for that class's performance ... shud be around 1 week to 2 week ....
i don't think practicing before sleeps helps tho .. =)
strong relative pitch shud work the same way with perfect pitch, but of course it works differently ... =)
to mera:
erm, if i didn't remember wrongly, i think that haydn didn't took long, cuz i was rushing for that class's performance ... shud be around 1 week to 2 week ....
i don't think practicing before sleeps helps tho .. =)
pf
New member
Hmmm...shld work the same way, but works different. What a riddle!
Anyways, I read somewhere that memorising music is an exercise to be practiced. If we memorise frequently, then it will be easier later.
Read elsewhere that it might be easier to memorise from the ending phrases of the music and slowly adding more of the front parts to the memorised parts.
A guest band conductor also said the similar thing to me before about learning music pieces years ago. Said that one will build up confidence as one plays as the music in the latter part has been played the most number of times. Confidence would help to reduce nervousness which might cause slips and memory lapse. I supposed.
And how about listening to the recording of the music piece when one is away from the piano? Would that help?
What do u guys think?
Anyways, I read somewhere that memorising music is an exercise to be practiced. If we memorise frequently, then it will be easier later.
Read elsewhere that it might be easier to memorise from the ending phrases of the music and slowly adding more of the front parts to the memorised parts.
A guest band conductor also said the similar thing to me before about learning music pieces years ago. Said that one will build up confidence as one plays as the music in the latter part has been played the most number of times. Confidence would help to reduce nervousness which might cause slips and memory lapse. I supposed.
And how about listening to the recording of the music piece when one is away from the piano? Would that help?
What do u guys think?
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pianomankris
New member
Firstly, the old adage 'practise makes perfect' is nonsense. It should be rephrased as 'Practise makes permanent'. So, practise something wrong, and you will become good at playing it badly!! And it can be diffiult to relearn a piece properly if you learn it wrong when younger.
Try 'overlap memorisation'. By the sounds of things, you probably learn things in large 'chunks', which is ok, until the nerves kick in, as if you lose it in your mind, you will have to go back to the last 'block' that you learned.
Overlap memorisation is as follows - sectionalise every part of the music e.g. practise bar 1 until you have it. Do the same with bar 2. Then practise bars 1 & 2 together.
Now practise bar 3 on its own until you have it. Then practise bars 2 & 3 together. You don't need to practise bars 1, 2 and 3 together, as the fluidity between bars 1 and 2 has already been learned. Repeat this process throughout e.g. learn and practise bar 4, then practise bars 3 and 4 together etc etc. It will look like this in your mind - 1-2 2-3 3-4 4-5 5-6 etc.
If this is too easy, you can increase the size of each section from one bar to a larger section. But make sure it is mentally under control.
Many people waste a lot of time learning one bar, then sticking it on to the rest of what they know. Hence pro pianists can learn what seems to be a very difficult piece very quickly, whereas it takes the amateur much longer. It is all to do with approach, and effective time management.
The benefit of overlap memorisation is that if you make a mistake in the middle somewhere, it is far easier to recover, as every single bar becomes a mental 'reference point'; you won't need to go back to the start of a full section.
Try 'overlap memorisation'. By the sounds of things, you probably learn things in large 'chunks', which is ok, until the nerves kick in, as if you lose it in your mind, you will have to go back to the last 'block' that you learned.
Overlap memorisation is as follows - sectionalise every part of the music e.g. practise bar 1 until you have it. Do the same with bar 2. Then practise bars 1 & 2 together.
Now practise bar 3 on its own until you have it. Then practise bars 2 & 3 together. You don't need to practise bars 1, 2 and 3 together, as the fluidity between bars 1 and 2 has already been learned. Repeat this process throughout e.g. learn and practise bar 4, then practise bars 3 and 4 together etc etc. It will look like this in your mind - 1-2 2-3 3-4 4-5 5-6 etc.
If this is too easy, you can increase the size of each section from one bar to a larger section. But make sure it is mentally under control.
Many people waste a lot of time learning one bar, then sticking it on to the rest of what they know. Hence pro pianists can learn what seems to be a very difficult piece very quickly, whereas it takes the amateur much longer. It is all to do with approach, and effective time management.
The benefit of overlap memorisation is that if you make a mistake in the middle somewhere, it is far easier to recover, as every single bar becomes a mental 'reference point'; you won't need to go back to the start of a full section.
i used to play a piece in loop so as to listen to it until i get sick of it. Then i break for awhile before repeating the cycle. Abit crude but i believe that constant repetition will somehow get into my subconscious.
that is just the first step. The next step is to playback the piece mentally in my head regularly until it becomes "fingertips". Meaning after i "mentally playback" a few notes i can regurgitate(mentally) the whole tune in an instant. And if i "spot" mistakes, or get stuck halfway, i go back to the previous step.
it's quite a tedious process and hard to achieve 100% accuracy. Usually i give and take a little, and *might* be satisfied with 8x-9x% accuracy (subjective to nature of the piece)
pf
New member
One approach that is very effective is to memorise the piece backwards. Start with the last bar...then the last two bars...and so on. It is effective because the newest bit to memorise is the first part you play, not the last part.
That way you will not only practice it from memory, you will also practice starting at any point in the piece.
A problem a lot of players have with memorised pieces is that if they stop half way they become totally lost and have to go back to the start.
That way you will not only practice it from memory, you will also practice starting at any point in the piece.
A problem a lot of players have with memorised pieces is that if they stop half way they become totally lost and have to go back to the start.
Hey, you can visit this website:
http://www.mariadewi.com/wordpress/?cat=170
It has some useful articles about memorizing music!!
http://www.mariadewi.com/wordpress/?cat=170
It has some useful articles about memorizing music!!