Hard Ash vs Swamp Ash

[robboster]

I've been wondering what the differences between these 2 are.
I can't really find much info about hard ash on the web, and some sources contradict each other, so I've decided to ask here

 

[bf0502tr]

quote from warmoth webby:
Northern Hard Ash is very hard, heavy and dense. A Strat® body will normally weigh 5 lbs. and up. Its density contributes to a bright tone and a long sustain which makes it very popular. Its color is creamy, but it also tends to have heartwood featuring pink to brown tints. The grain pores are open and it takes a lot of finish to fill them up.

Swamp Ash is a prized wood for many reasons. It is a fairly light weight wood which makes it easily distinguishable from Hard Ash. A Strat® body will normally weigh under 5 lbs. Many of the 50's Fenders were made of Swamp Ash. The grain is open and the color is creamy. This wood is a very nice choice for clear finishes. Swamp Ash is our second most popular wood. It is a very musical wood offering a very nice balance of brightness and warmth with a lot of "pop".

 

[subversion]

majority of the manufactured guitars in the stores are of the swamp ash make, the other heavier alternative is just too impractical/ massive for regular embrace.

 

[Jumpin'Jellybean]

^I thought most guitars used Alder or basswood?

 

[subversion]

referring ash-bodied guitars...

 

[naviros]

From Andy's Corner, ProGuitarShop.

Ash that is referred as “Swamp Ash” is a light-weight porous wood that comes from the swamps of Southern USA. What comes from a tree that grows partially engulfed in water is an intriguing formulation of hard and soft lines in the ring of the tree. The resulting tone of Ash is what people usually call “bell-like” because of its detailed high end and excellent dynamic range. We all know that Fender used Ash in the 50’s to produce some of the greatest Telecasters in history. The ultra light nature of this striking tonewood helps the guitar to sing and twang like no other. In general, swamp ash retains a very dynamic character along with strong lows and nice balance of warmth and bite.

Northern Ash is a denser, heavier species of wood that will have more sustain and an even brighter tone. However, the mass makes it less snappy than the lighter swamp variety. I should mention that every body varies just as trees do in nature. On top of that, a wide variety of species exist of these types of wood around the world. So you might find a heavy ash body or dull piece of alder. That’s why it’s a good idea to get your hands on a guitar and plug in before you buy.

His conclusion, by the way, was that it all depends on maker's construction, rather than type of wood. Wood alone doesn't determine the final tone, especially when chambering and other weight relieving techniques are employed.

 

[subversion]

yes, it doesn't determine the final tone but it's a formative basis; what one uses to start with will end up manifesting what one started with, not a different subject entirely.

 

[relinquish69]

I usually pick up an ash bodied guitar to guess whether it's hard ash / swamp ash since we can't tell by merely looking at the grain patterns. long story short, lighter = swamp & heavier = hard. However, some say the weight of the guitar is determined by where the wood is taken from. Therefore, we can't really use weight as a basis. Not an issue to me because I don't have a preference for ash wood in general.

Difference in tone? Not too sure. IMHO ash sounds like ash (in terms of wood characteristics). It's a matter of whether one sounds sweeter compared to the other.

 

[subversion]

it should supplement good tones, above all else. otherwise, it's a futile feature as an instrument component.

 

[robboster]

I don't get the PGS example... aren't Northern Ash and Alder 2 different woods?

 

[eieio]

I don't get the PGS example... aren't Northern Ash and Alder 2 different woods?

Let me try, PGS eg. means that

every body varies just as trees do in nature...
so you might find a heavy ash body when ash is commonly light(weight?)
or dull piece of alder in which alder is normally not associated with dull(grain/tone wise?)

make sense?