Guitar's SoundCheck during jamming and live.

[Newbie]

Hi there. Just wondering, in studio, if im not wrong the bass gotta balance out with the drums 1st, then i got 2 guit and 1 vocals.. so...

so after bass... what comes next? rythm? vocals last?




and another thing. i notice a lot of gigs they so soundcheck before the performance. but the problem is, the sound especially the lead guitarist's sound cannot be heard, when he's soloing. its covered up by the other instruments.

lets say if u got booster, if u soundcheck, the booster the ppl incharge of the sound thingy will also balance out right? then whats the pt of the booster? or is it u just soundcheck the rythm part, then just dont bother abt the booster at the start. until ur solo comes then step on the booster? mmm


sorry quite new to this, please help.

 

[Metallando]

sometimes soundman will ask u to play one whole song for the soundcheck so he can adjust his stuff to u're band, and u can give them u're list of songs that u gonna play, so he'll know the sequencing much better esp for cover songs.....ah..many things ah....most soundman that i've come across will just do it 'on the spot' during the band's actual set...

 

[Newbie]

but most of the gigs i see, they test like 30 seconds only.

 

[neuro182]

Yups

yea.. lyk jus play it overall a short segment den he adjust e sound level, so that nobody is either too loud or too soft.

 

[Newbie]

yeah thats the problem... then the solo cant be heard...

sometimes the riffs also cannot be heard...

 

[thor666]

sigh. i hate the soundcheck.

is there any professional way of doing a soundcheck? seems like different soundman do differently and they do it their way... u have no control over the actual sound...

 

[neuro182]

whEe!@!

then u gotta tell e pa crew to maybe increase vol of e lead guit or wat la. its all up to ur band's preference mah their sound check is usually by default - everyone level to equal

that is of cuz imo

 

[mikemann]

OK, this question asked can be easily answered. So listen up.

It depends on the experience of the soundman(the guy controlling the PA) of the gig.

The guitar sound is a very loud sound as it's in the mid audible freq range, like vocal. Even at soft level, people can hear it better than other instruments. That's because human ears are tuned more to vocal freq.

If your gig is not miked up. (ie. guitar amp alone, the PA do not amplify the guitar amp)
The soundman will tell you on how loud you should be playing. You are basically on your own to dictate the loudness. DO NOT anyhow crank your amp up, keep to the limit given. Or you will risk drowning the rest of your band members. Look at the soundman once in a while, if you are not loud enough, he will tell you. You will need to "Self Boost" when you are doing your solo.

If your gig is miked up, listen carefully. DO NOT play the guitar amp at live unmiked level, play it such as you can listen yourself, can already. The soundman will feed accordingly to the monitors and adjust the main feed as well to the audience. Cause if you drown out the rest of your band, the soundman can't help you. But if you are not loud enough, he can feed in the additional boost. When soloing, you can "Self Boost" if you like, or the soundman can do that for you too, if he is experienced enough, he will know what to do.

In any case, DO NOT EVER argue with the soundman. If he is lousy, too bad anyway. Remember, if the soundman is mad at you, he CAN and WILL muck up your part for you. He will have the last laugh. So remember that, being cool as cucumber will help. Remember the soundman is in immense pressure too, not just you.

So best to have an ego to fit your own shoe, thats enough.

 

[thor666]

thanks mikemann.

i think i pissed off the soundman a bit that day... oops.

but it's really fustrating to be playing and not knowing anything about the sound. The monitors didn't help much. Perhaps i should have asked him to increase the volume a bit for the monitors.

 

[mikemann]

Haha....yeah lah.....that's life.

Sometime someone else is at the controls of your life, so you are at his mercy, like it or not, you have to face it.

So if the soundman is lousy and have a zepplin sized ego, too bad. Just let him be, or you will be worst off if you go and tick him off.

If he is good and give you a good performance result, and the audience cheer wildly for you. Give hime a pat on the back and thank him. Cause you are the one who get the credits but he is the one who is supporting your back.

The soundman is also a performer in his own rights, but seldom gets any credit. At the end of the day, everyone goes home and he is likely still behind helping to pack up can carry the heaviest and most equipments of the gig.

So I hope those who reads this could learn something and apply it to your own gig.

Give others their due respect, you (performer) are not the only one who is responsible for the performance.

 

[neuro182]

Hmm

True True.. The final sentence sums it all up

 

[gordonzz]

treat ur soundman a smoke before it starts

 

[neuro182]

NO FHM or MAXIM

!ALERT! nvr treat ur soundman a FHM or Maxim mag b4 e concert or else he might pays more attention on dose Hot Sexy Bods than ur Rockerific licks & riffs *lolx*

 

[Colarndo]

As a previous soundman myself, let me give you the other side of the story.

Usually at a gig, there are so many bands. To juggle and note down the different settings of every band is very hard. So a chop chop(very fast) sound check is done. This is just a rough sound check. (Professionsal bands take hours to sound check so don't compare).

After soundchecking so many bands, the soundman will also be sian especially if the current band is pretty screwed up. It's dis-heartening when you see the vocalist hitting the mic when he gets impatient. Amatuer bands who don't know how to set-up also a big headache.

Also the sound board is not run by the boss himself, so the soundman has to note that he's on a tight scehedule. Or not tekan by the boss. Of course more experienced soundman can do a fast and decent sound check.

You have to always know soundchecking is totally different from when you are actually playing when the show starts. The soundman has to do a FOH(Front Of House) mix after he's done with your monitors. He won't bother about you after soundcheck, his job is to make the mix sound good. The mix may sound bad from where you're standing, but it may sound good to the audience. Trust the soundman.

I've known and seen bands really F*** up their soundman because they think the soundman knows shit abt tone and their music. Let's just say you give the soundman shit, he will give you shit. He's not the one losing. He still gets paid the same way.

Doesn't mean the soundman from one company is bad doesn't mean the all the soundman in the industry are all bad. You do realise most soundman are man, so egos plays a factor.

It really helps a lot of someone praises my mix. Especially of you do a really long..show with so many bands. Think Street festival kind. After all, we're all human. I personally like to try and interact with the band to ease the tension from both sides. Try talking to your soundman, it helps. Even if it's talking cock.

 

[mikemann]

Yeah.... colarndo raised a point there, I'd like to strengthen.

A lot of bands have this misconception that they must sound good to themselves. They relate this as if they sound good to themselves, then they sound good to the audience. Meaning from the monitors.

Ok, MONITOR SPEAKERS is just what it's said to be, just monitors for you to catch your own part. As long as you can hear your bands parts, be it sounding good or crappy, is most important.

Cause monitors are secondary stuff, the parts are seldom eq properly to the monitors. So it's purpose is for you to get you own cue, that's all. Not sound like the main FOH mix to the audience.

Do you know, the more the monitors are cranked up, the worst the main mix will sound, due to run-offs being re-amplified and easier to feedback to the mics.

The FOH mix will depend solely on the skills of the soundman to help you mix all your parts properly for the audience.

So cut the inhibitions and perform to your best, knowing you can't help it if the soundman is good or bad. That's just life.

 

[soft]

Monitor also very important. Coz if musician cannot 'feel' the music, they sure become very pissed.

but definitely do not turn up guitar/bass/keyboard amp so loud that it drowns out the vocal that is coming from the monitor speakers. if not, everyone will :smt101

 

[Newbie]

hmm ive went to a lot of gigs and stuffs... the main problem is always the monitor speakers...

the band's always complaining not being able to hear themselves...


sorry ive never been on a stage and perform before but, when drums + bass + vox + ur guit amp "piang" out together, u wont be able to hear ur own stuffs meh?


i mean wont it be even MORE noisy? =/

 

[Colarndo]

If the monitor mix is good, sound leaking from external sources shouldn't interfere so much. Monitor mix can be controlled, you don't have to have every instrument blasting from your monitors mix

 

[dEeN]

rule 1.. band members neednt worry abt da FOH mix... as in they don need to worry abt what da audience is hearing.. they should worry more abt they monitor mix.. coz da sound engn are capable enough to mix.. if nt they wouldnt be there rite?

 

[MansteaM]

Hi People,

I'm not so good, just have been jamming for bout nearly 20 years.

If you are referring to jamming studio without soundman, here my tips.

Drummer - electronically you don't control your sound level, so just concerntrate on beat.

The rest please avoid standing too near to your own amp, move around to more centralise so that you can compare each others volume level.

Bear in mind, the vocalist should be the loudest in the room. So the rest, except drum must not level above him.

So after vocalist has level himself to the highest (not until humming), the rest (bass & rhythm guitar) then adjust to lower than vocalist. Common mistake is the music always tend to volume above the vocal. Once fixed, bass & rhythm should not adjust anymore for the whole jamming session. The most you can do is only play with sound effect.

During guitar solo, then lead guitar will be the loudest in the room (not until humming too).

If you are the only guitarist (1 man guitarist) then you must learn to volume low when there's vocal, high when you solo.