Need recommendations for active monitors for many purposes

[astaroth]

Main purpose right now is to use it for my POD HD500. My signal chain is something like:

Guitar/Bass > POD HD > Echo Audiofire 2 via XLR to Balanced TRS > Active Monitors via Balanced TRS to whatever is the monitors' input

Other purposes includes mixing and mastering as well as general use for music and movies etc. Music and movies are pretty secondary, I don't care much about that, most important is transparent sound for amp sims and studio monitoring.

So far I have identified a few recommended monitors:

KRK Rockit RP5
ESI nEar05
Wharfdale Diamond Pro 8.2
Acoustic Energy AE22

Budget is about $400-500, probably no higher. Any advise is greatly appreciated.

 

[squarehero]

Check the specs of the monitors for flat frequency response with good dispersion characteristics and low amplifier distortion.

Here, I've listed for you what I gleaned from the specs of your current choices:
In order of frequency response from best to worst:
Rokit (flatter but doesn't go as low as Wharfdale) and Wharfdale (better bass extension), Acoustic Energy AE 22, ESI (Underspecified technical data)

In order of dispersion characteristics which are important for untreated rooms (from best to worst):
All monitors underspecified so you don't really know which one would sound better.

In terms of low distortion characteristics:
Only wharfdale lists distortion characteristics which is 0.1%. All other monitors listed do not specify distortion characteristics of their amplifiers.

Also, you will need a system that goes to 40 Hz if you intend to do any form of mastering or mixing. My suggestion is you go and listen to something well specified and good sounding like a Genelec 8030A first. Remember the sound. Then go and listen to all the speakers you listed before making a choice.

 

[kongwee]

For me, the more "flat" is the speaker, the more important on the position. Push against the wall is the worst for technically good speaker.

 

[astaroth]

=squarehero

Thank you very much for the advice! May I know where is a good place to test out the Genelec?

 

[astaroth]

For me, the more "flat" is the speaker, the more important on the position. Push against the wall is the worst for technically good speaker.

So I have to have some space away from the walls? Maybe some Mopads underneath as well?

 

[Cheez]

I've used the nEar05 for years - until my kids dropped one of them and it was never the same. Found the high frequencies lacking compared to others. For KRK, there are those that are made in China (China KRK branch), of which I'm told by my engineer friend that the quality is lower - but also cheaper of course.

 

[astaroth]

But the china made models are still named the same right? Thanks for pointing this out to me

 

[Cheez]

China models are exactly the same except that the parts are made in China and there are markings saying that the unit is made in China. This is the same for many things - many monitor speakers, guitars, pianos etc. Most are not a problem - some are slightly inferior, depending on your tolerance level for quality control. I've been living in China for a while - and I can get a nice Takamine guitar half the price for the same model overseas, for example. It's not an imitation - just made by the China Takamine factory. Nice tone as well. I was surprised when I bought a MOTU audio interface online in China not too long ago, and it was actually made in USA! I didn't quite expect that!

When I bought my Sony Vaio notebook a number of years ago, I noticed that with the exact same model, it cost cheaper when bought from the China Sony stores (with more RAM etc). When I asked the Singapore Sony store, they told me not to go for it because the parts are from China instead of Japan, and (according to Sony Singapore) they are slightly inferior. So I bought it in Singapore.

 

[astaroth]

hrm i see, so its largely a hit or miss issue.

 

[l0u5y]

i dun recommend the wharfedale. i dunno about acoustic energy. ESI is sort of okay only. KRK is pretty decent for the price as im currently using a pair now. It is not terrific but mixing on it will pretty much translate well on other systems. Just need a bit of tweaking here and there to get it done.

 

[astaroth]

what is deficient with the wharfdale in your opinion?

 

[kongwee]

So I have to have some space away from the walls? Maybe some Mopads underneath as well?

1/3 or 2/5 away from the wall is often being use as a guide. If you are get two feet away, this is good enough. I never believe in damping material under the speaker cos it is uneven if you wanna get mirror image placement between your speaker. Most important note is the stand must very stable and solid, not shaky kind. Your monitor should seat film that the rule. Try not to put many thing between you and your monitor .

You wanna know about speaker placement go Adephli opposite Funan Centre. All are listening expensive speaker. Observe some of the good sounding room. Look at speaker placement and seating position, they observed a certain rule under "normal" room condition or slightly treated room.

Get a good position you solve 30% of the problem without spending. If my monitor push to wall, my peak to peak amplitude is greatest at ~35db (range 45hz-17khz). In my current position is about 25db cos my monitor is about 3 feet away from the wall.

 

[astaroth]

2 feet away is already quite difficult for me since my room and desk is small haha but i'll see what I can do. thanks a lot for all the advice!

 

[unsane]

1/3 or 2/5 away from the wall is often being use as a guide. If you are get two feet away, this is good enough. I never believe in damping material under the speaker cos it is uneven if you wanna get mirror image placement between your speaker. Most important note is the stand must very stable and solid, not shaky kind. Your monitor should seat film that the rule.

would you care to elaborate, i'm having quite a bit of trouble understanding your post, especially about the damping material.

 

[kongwee]

would you care to elaborate, i'm having quite a bit of trouble understanding your post, especially about the damping material.

Damping material mean rubber or anything not very solid under the monitor. Especially rubber type, they will sink a little over 1 or 2 year. Some the quality cannot withstand our climate and begin to soften. I used to pull spike or solid feet under my monitor. However I change to a new stand, it is higher so I don't put anything under now. So also my new stand got rubbers to act as feet for the monitor. At the moment lazy to remove it.

 

[squarehero]

Astaroth,
Team108 is the official distributor of Genelec and Hung Brothers at Sim Lim carries it in retail. You may have to ask if they have the bigger versions.

Regarding Kong Wee's post, positioning is very important in small rooms. I know because I set up listening rooms professionally. One of the main problems with small rooms are room modes or standing waves causing flabby bass. What we usually do for minimally treated small rooms is cancel out one of the axial standing waves by placing the monitor symmetrically 1/4 of the room length (which means each speaker's acoustic axis is 25% away from the side wall). We will then do Digital EQ to smoothen the response of the speakers at a pre-determined sweet spot. EQ'ing is unavoidable in small rooms because of the lack of space to put sufficient bass trapping.

As for putting it away from the wall, it really depends. The bass response of small speakers is boosted if it is radiating while against the wall. This works well for speakers with less bass. Unfortunately, since all speaker measurements are made in free space, we are not able to predict the response of a speaker against the wall based on the frequency response chart given by the manufacturer. So, what we do usually is to measure the speaker in the room and do correction based on that.

One other problem with walls is something we call Speaker Boundary Interference. This is a cancellation from a reflection of the back wall. The only way around this is proper acoustic treatment.

Regarding damping of the cabinet, there are 2 schools. One school uses a isolating layer of rubber mat or foam to decouple the speaker from the furniture or the speaker stand. Another school uses spikes to transfer all vibrations of the cabinet to the floor as quickly as possible. What you get from both of them is tighter bass.

 

[kongwee]

For me, I don't do EQing. I used to setup audiophile system. EQing is not an option. Even I can do a 20hz to 20khz sweep test to figure out peak and the dips, can't bring myself to do EQing.

 

[squarehero]

KW, I understand your point of view. I believe EQ'ing is not sacrilege to audiophiles as they do use Room Correction software like Audyssey to auto correct for their room response.

For us, we only EQ in the bass frequencies. Some phase shift due to EQ'ing is definitely preferable to having inadequate or boomy bass due to room modes.

We don't EQ comb filter artifacts as these usually sound harsh when they are EQ'ed.

 

[astaroth]

Another question I have for bros here: In your experience would such small monitors require subwoofers? Especially since their bass response isnt as good as more costly monitors. Or would it be better to simply save for something better.

 

[kongwee]

Subwoofer is not easy to integrated into the small monitor. It is hard to get in phase with the small monitor. Of cos don't let my comment stopping you to buy an subwoofer, cos you still need to know what going go on the 40Hz and below. Personally, I have yet to buy a subwoofer.