rudiments or groves?

[mix]

rudiments or groves?

i realizd many of us are playing groves rather then rudiments when we first started drumming. i guess its not wrong too. rudiments lets you express yourself more freely, it builds your techniques, and most God-like drummers will say they base their solos around rudiments.

but on the other hand, groves are things that keeps you going. for drummers, the most important thing is for you to play good beats that relates to the song. and knowing all the rudiments in the world will not let you play good dynamics.

so heres the question. rudiments or groves?

 

[joshie]

rudiments definitely. get your rudiments right before grooving. whats the point on playing grooves that are limited since you dont have the ability to execute. its gonna sound horrid. ive been there before.

 

[drummar-buah]

u can't just base your drumming on rudiments. neither should u neglect them.

rudiments are as important as grooves. they work in together hand-in-hand.

quote from joshie "whats the point on playing grooves that are limited since you dont have the ability to execute"
then again, what's the point of being the best rudimental drummer when u don't have the slightest groove when u play.

of course, it depends on the situation. you could be playing in a band who likes to play blues or the common pop,rock songs u hear on the radio. like britney spears or whatever. this all requires a great deal of groove but may not require to be rudimentally deep. groove is always the first image u present to pple. (other than first impressions and showmanship). in fact, ALL SONGS MUST HAVE GROOVE. even the most technical kind of songs to be played has to have groove. example? VIRGIL DONATI.

i have to emphasize that rudiments are hell important. but having grooves are just as important.
when u practice with grooves, subconsciously you are developing your rudiments too, cuz naturally for drummers, we love to explore our capabilities and try to push ourself to go faster and stuff.
when u practice rudiments, you can form grooves with them. and that's how solos take place eventually.

above all these. i have to say that TIMEKEEPING is the most important out of everything. owned.. :lol: :lol:

 

[hi]

hmm i guess for new players, rudiments are more impt bah... groove is something that can only grow on good foundation...

 

[mix]

does playing grooves help you in your rudiments or techniques?

i think when one goes fast to his/her limits, techniqies tend to go way off.
dun cha think??

 

[joshie]

yes very off way.. your rudiments have to be strong if you wanna play rudimental drumset as in with grooves.

 

[mix]

hws your rudiments josh??

 

[Funkifized]

don't you just hate people who put down chops immediately because they 'don't groove'? or 'contribute nothing to the music'?

chopin had massive chops (i really suspect that term came from his name), but no one really put him down for his amazing (some say excessive) displays of technique.

i guess the main reason why i learn chops is because, well, think of it: a car with a small engine will cause you to be afraid of pushing it faster, it'll go really slow and will probably screw up if you try to push it. A lamborghini will never have those issues, coz it just has the capacity to push itself. You probably will never ever push it on the roads of Singapore, but with the knowledge that you CAN if you want to will contribute massively towards your confidence.

same for chops; it makes me feel more confident and i can ramp up the extremeness if i want to, but probably never will shift into the highest gear.

so how? stick with a small 'car' and keep time, earning your pay that you get from keeping that 2 n 4, or push yourselves and actually contribute something new and fresh to the table? for me, i don't wanna be known as the 'solid timekeeper'; they're all over the place (though my time is not good lah haha).

 

[drummar-buah]

yah that's very true.

it shouldn't be on how good u are rudimentally or how groovy a drummer u are. i'd say, learn wat u can. keep upgrading urself.

 

[mix]

hey funktified, its a really complicated example u have there. lol

yah, rudiments helps you express yourself more freely.

 

[daltonsim]

alot of rudiments improve coordination. i think grooves improve your range of playing and your 'feeling'. but rudiments are like basics, so i don't know. i like how Steve Gadd moves the rudiments onto the kit, like his paradiddle groove and his paradiddlediddle groove.

 

[blurred]

hey guys,
both are important, u need to spend time on both. i was wrong to say groove was more important cause it isn't to some point. i noticed that if a drummer didn't practice rudiments at all or had a bad grip his sound was really bad. rudiments teach us how to hit the drum and "bring the sound out" as the classical percussionist say all the time. no rudiments= a very bad sound on the drums. dun spend too much time on rudiments though as having a good time feel and being a good chart reader is really essential if not more. a good drummer makes or breaks a band, a gd drummer can carrying the band on his back and make it sound decent.
you need:
rudiments
groove
reading skills
ability to as many styles as u can
being responsible, on time and have ur stuff learned

 

[killinghall]

I agree with Joshie that rudiments should come first. They invariably show the way to basic grooves, and open up possibilities to a world of more.

 

[drummar-buah]

honestly, i don't like the idea of comparing groove vs rudiments. i prefer thinking about practicing groove and rudiments consistently together. and not practice them one overlapping the other.

 

[hi]

hmm but i guess the context is on beginners... yup... so i thought rudiments should come first... as the late Mr Elwin Jones mentioned before that any drummer should spend a year on rudiments first before moving on...

and for all the jazz greats i think they were great rudimentalists before going on to any else...

i was also once told that the first 3 years in learning music is really muscle building... we don't really effectively learn to make music in those 3 years... so i guess rudiments is part of those years for a beginner right? after all without rudiments, it's harder to give a good groove which makes it harder for other musicians working with us to make music...

just some food for thought hahaha...

but i guess when we move on to become musician/ drummers later on in our playing, then we got to balance both i guess...

 

[joshie]

hws your rudiments josh??

excellent *nose grows longer*

 

[joshie]

Aiya! We need a good balance la!

 

[mix]

haha, yah.

and i think for the first few years, technique should be more important then the musicianship.