Need advice on getting a classical / semi-acoustic guitar

[gakz]

Hello all, i've been an electric guitarist for a long time now, and am planning to switch to either a classical or semi-acoustic. I seem to have lost interest in rock/metal-playing styles, and more inclined towards a clean sound now. Planning to pick up fingerstyle plucking as well.

Need some recommendations on brands of classical / semi-acoustic (I heard yamaha ones are good?) before I purchase them.. Budget's not too high since i'm new in this area, so I'd say about 200 odd?

The classical guitars which I've played so far didn't really had a good feel (the action's too high, maybe the condition's just bad). I tried a fender acoustic before and i kinda like the action and feel of the guitar, pretty much similar to an electric. Is there a classical guitar which doesn't have that fat a neck or that high an action? Also, any alternative semi-acoustic besides fender which suits my budget range?

Hope to hear some from classical / semi acoustic players here. Thanks in advance!

 

[robb]

all classical guitars have a fat neck.for ur budget of 200+/- I think ur better off looking at the 2nd hand market on soft. for that price point the best are yamaha. DO NOT get brands like fender, ibanez, congress etc etc
If you want a thin neck than maybe u should look into getting a hybrid guitar like godin. Thin neck with nylon strings. Yamaha also has them i think, its the GPX series or something

Good luck

 

[Jumpin'Jellybean]

From the title, you seem like someone who is very new to this area of guitar? Correct me if i'm wrong.
For 200 bucks, you can check out the Takamine lower ends as well as the Custom Acoustic lower ends. Both have very good reviews and are bang for the buck, especially when you have such a low budget. A Classical gutiar has a wider neck as compared to Acoustics and Electrics. Thus your hand may not be suited to it.
Acoustic gutiar strings are tough stuff too. Semi acoustics, means you want an acoustic with built in electronics or you are fine with a pure acoustic? Built in electronics obviously cost more. As for Classical guitar brands, Yamaha is one of the biggest importers of them. Then there are the budget ones, like TGM, Synchronium, etc.

 

[gakz]

all classical guitars have a fat neck.for ur budget of 200+/- I think ur better off looking at the 2nd hand market on soft. for that price point the best are yamaha. DO NOT get brands like fender, ibanez, congress etc etc
If you want a thin neck than maybe u should look into getting a hybrid guitar like godin. Thin neck with nylon strings. Yamaha also has them i think, its the GPX series or something

Good luck

Putting the fat neck aside (I could get used to it, just a matter of practice), what about the action of classical guitars? I've had some terrible experiences with extremely high action on a classical. Wonder if the problem lies with me or that particular classical guitar (a really cheap one).

 

[gakz]

From the title, you seem like someone who is very new to this area of guitar? Correct me if i'm wrong.
For 200 bucks, you can check out the Takamine lower ends as well as the Custom Acoustic lower ends. Both have very good reviews and are bang for the buck, especially when you have such a low budget. A Classical gutiar has a wider neck as compared to Acoustics and Electrics. Thus your hand may not be suited to it.
Acoustic gutiar strings are tough stuff too. Semi acoustics, means you want an acoustic with built in electronics or you are fine with a pure acoustic? Built in electronics obviously cost more. As for Classical guitar brands, Yamaha is one of the biggest importers of them. Then there are the budget ones, like TGM, Synchronium, etc.

Yeap i'm new to this area of guitar. I've heard some stuffs about yamaha classical guitars being overpriced, and that we're playing for the brand more than the quality. In fact, some people even suggested China-makes which are slightly cheaper but are comparable in quality. That's why I'm hoping to seek some advice here before deciding on one.

And yeah, I think I've decided on a classical instead of a semi-acoustic. So yeap looking for options now. Have heard of hybrid guitars as well, any one has any recommendation on the available brands of hybrid classical guitars? I guess I could increase my budget since it doesn't seem so feasible.

 

[naviros]

I'm selling my Takamine for 200 if you're interested.

http://soft.com.sg/forum/showthread.php?t=185225&p=1066612#post1066612

 

[EugeneSmasher]

Alvarez and Carvin have nylon-string hybrid guitars, but I think they're gonna be expensive...

 

[Jumpin'Jellybean]

Alvarez is quite high end. Nylon string hybrids as in Nylon with electronics? Taylor's Jason Mraz Artist Series! Going for 3.8k... Hahaha.
Not many have Classicals with electronics. More likely a Flamenco, which is a type of Spanish 6-string Nylon guitar.

 

[loldude333]

Hmmmm so you're absolutely sure you want a classical? There are several major differences:

1. The neck WIDTH. As you've mentioned, the neck feels a little big in your hand. That's due to the width, not the thickness. IMHO classicals have pretty thin necks. I've been playing classical for 6 years, and i haven't tried one with a 'fat' neck yet. Of course, its just a matter of perception, as i do have big hands. But for a comparison, i find the neck on my Takamine EG5303SC a little fat.

2. The string spacing. A consequence of the wider neck, its needed because most classical players use fingers, not picks, so fast string skipping isn't the priority, rather it's preventing stray fingers from unecessarily hitting other strings during their classical pieces.

3. Action. You've also mentioned this. I believe (altho i'm not 100% sure, this is my hypothesis based on experience playing classical for 6 years and comparing with electric and acoustic, both of which i've been playing for 4 years) that classical strings tend to have a higher amplitude when plucked, as in they vibrate more. However, this does NOT mean they vibrate longer. Hence a higher action is needed to prevent string buzz. Once you've gotten used to high action on a classical, especially when playing at the higher frets, the stock action on most other guitars shouldn't bother you, which is a plus point for me.

4. Sustain. As i mentioned, the string vibrates more, but for a shorter duration, i believe its due to the shorter string length and the lower tension. Classicals are designed like that because most classical guitarists will play in an ensemble at some point in time (like me) and the added sustain isn't needed, in fact it tends to muddy up the overall tone of an ensemble quite a bit.

5. Tone. This is because the treble strings are made of nylon, which is much more mellow sounding, no metallic acoustic-like ringing from these strings. The bass strings are also made of nylon, but wound with steel i believe. Hence the overall sound is much more mellow than a normal acoustic, it will never have that same metallic quality.

I think there are more, but i'm a bit lazy to go find out what the other differences are, but i hope you've taken these into consideration before choosing. If you're looking to go into things like Villa-Lobos Choros No. 1 for example, then i'd definitely say classical. However, if you're going into Tommy Emmanuel or Andy McKee stuff, an acoustic will work better.

Overall, having played both, i would say that if you want to open yourself to all avenues, then a classical is better, because it can do more genres than an acoustic, altho acoustic stuff played on it won't sound as good. However, i've tried playing classical stuff on an acoustic before. No go there, the extra sustain made it sound terrible.

Hope this has helped, feel free to correct me if i'm wrong. Cheerz!

 

[gakz]

whoa thanks loldude333 for the information! I see you're very passionate about what you're doing, and that's great. so i guess the action and the 'neck fatness' which i've been talking about would go away with practice, and i'm perfectly fine with it. so long as i start off with a decent classical guitar which doesn't put me off due to its uncomfortable handling.

personal preference-wise, i would prefer the warmer and mellower tone of a classical as compared to the acoustic. it's just like how i prefer hums to single coil on the electric guitar, and how i always loved the tone of a les paul. For a moment, i was just unsure of which to get - a classical or an acoustic cuz my main purpose was to explore a new avenue. but posting my thoughts here somehow helped me to make a decision.

ok so now, the search is on for an okay-quality classical guitar. really appreciate the replies here, you guys are awesome. btw, any one knows of any sites which i can refer to pick up fingerstyle-plucking (instead of the pick, i don't even know if it's the right term to use - fingerstyle)?

thanks in advance!

 

[EugeneSmasher]

Do note that if you intend to do strumming on a classical, it's gonna sound very muddy even if you use an expensive guitar and/or an expensive set of strings. Classicals are ideal for fingerstyle and arpeggios. If that is what you want to learn, then it's a good choice to move to classical.

The wider string spacing of a classical means that you can be more precise in fingerstyle playing. I'm playing Francisco Tarrega's 'Lagrima' on a regular steel-string acoustic and the narrow string spacing gets on my nerves all the time.

Yamaha and Takamine classicals are one of the more reasonably priced around, and they offer pretty nice specs too. Yamaha is pricey if you buy firsthand from Yamaha outlets, so you might want to pick a secondhand one from here which would be a whole lot more affordable. I gave mine away and really regret doing that now... Takamine is quite affordable so paying Davis a visit and seeing their classicals would be a good idea.

Also, whether or not you need a pickup... most classical guitarists I watch don't use in-built electronics. They play sitting down, so mounting a microphone in front is a better idea and yields a more natural tone besides. Put a piezo on a classical and it'll sound terrible! At least to my ears.

 

[loldude333]

Agreed with eugenesmasher. I'd always go for a mic anyday, even with acoustics. Maybe its because i'm more into Justin King and Andy McKee stuff now, which requires percussion to be played on the guitar body itself, hence a mic picks it up better than a piezo ever will. If you're looking at budget classicals, i do recommend J&D classicals too. They've got a very good tone for the price. Yamaha to me sounds too bland, Takamine i've never tried before. And yes, i am very passionate about guitars, however my time playing classical has come to an end, i've 'graduated' from my school's ensemble as i'm a J2.

There are many types of fingerstyle plucking, i suggest youtube. It's better than just reading words anyday. And it appeals to kiasu Singaporeans like me because its FREE!

Even if you don't intend on trying classical stuff, let me encourage to try, because

1. It really trains your left hand. Because solo classical guitarists have to play the treble, mid and bass parts all on one guitar, more often than not you'll have to have very good technique to pull it off. This'll definitely help your electric guitar technique too. Some nice songs to try:
Heitor Villa-Lobos Choros No. 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAg8VHuXNKU
Andrew York's Moontan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqoVI8XLmDA
Sevilla by Isaac Albeniz (this one's hard!): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvI2soLrUGA&feature=related
Malaguena (this ones hard too!): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdKogZMyCMk

These 4 are my personal favourites.

2. It gives you opportunities to make friends! Why? Because classical guitarists can also play in an ensemble! Yes it's extremely fun to just get together and play, and playing in ensembles is easier because the song is split into parts, so the individual parts are pretty easy. Great if you're a beginner!
Some of my favourite ensemble pieces:
Lotus Eaters by Andrew York: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVBN1NV9F38, by Singapore's own ACJC Guitar Ensemble: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=by4o-nZrh2w
Malaguena, by an ensemble this time: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wIA6pKmqcr8&feature=related
Pirates of the Carribean Cover, again by ACJCGE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUGVG6o2Klw

Yeah so i hope you can find the time (and the people, if you're interested in ensemble playing) to learn some of these pieces. You know, i used to hate classical guitar, the sitting position was just so alien to me, and i thought i didn't look 'pro' playing single notes. That has all changed. I've now learnt to appreciate many genres of music.

And yeah, see if you can spot me in the ACJCGE vids haha! Cheers man! Keep the guitar playing fire going!

 

[gakz]

thanks for the great recommendations loldude333! i'll definitely check those videos out. And Eugenesmasher, yes i'm intending to pick up fingerstyle more than just strumming. in fact, i've just gotten a takamine classical from one of the softies here, and it sounds great for a budget end classical. felt a lot better than the 'cheapo' ones which i've tried at my friends' place previously.

i'll post up here again if i need further advice on playing techniques. you guys were of great help man! let's hope my classical journey would be a fulfilling one! heh.

 

[gakz]

loldude333, the 4 of your personal favourites were awesome, i personally liked moontan the most. but i think these are rather hard to pick up for a beginner. as i'm totally new to classical, would you be so kind to recommend some easier (yet catchy ones) for a beginner?

also, i'm training fingerstyle playing, and so far i've used all my fingers on my right hand except my pinky. I'm afraid of developing a bad habit if i totally neglect it. pls advice, classical players out there!

 

[loldude333]

Hmmmm moontan's easier than it looks. You just gotta get used to playing more stuff on one guitar. One of the easiest is probably greensleeves, you can check that one out. Sevilla you can do maybe in a year, if you practice hard. The main thing is to get the hang of it. The rest is easy.

 

[Kyokkai]

Yamaha items(guitars) are oftenly overpriced and it's not worth the quality...u shld try Takamaine or Maestro and I think ur budget of 200 is a little bit low...hahas. When i started out...I had a budget of 300 plus(not excceding 400) for both my electric and acoustic...it was initially lower but it increased as I realised that cheap guitars are not worth it. Cheap guitars last u 1-3 years or so but an averaged priced guitars (300-500) can last you almost 7-10+ years if u take care of it. My acoustic has been with me for like 7 yrs and it's still a nice piece of art...

 

[kashfun]

you may want to check out the Maestro SA series. I have the SA-1 and it sounds great!
Maestro is SG brand btw